#forcedattrition

Companies that have punitively restructured their comp plan, rarely walk it back.

A return to a fair comp plan only happens when one of three breaking points hits:

1. Regrettable Attrition Hits Top Performers: Right now, Dell is fine with underperforming and mid-tier reps quitting. They want forced attrition. However, when more of the top 10%–15% of enterprise account executives defect to HPE, Lenovo, Cisco, or Super Micro (taking billion-dollar accounts with them), Dell will care.

2. Legacy Business Collapses Faster Than Expected: While AI servers get the headlines, Dell still relies on high-margin storage, servers, and commercial PCs to fund its bottom line. If gutted sales territories and demoralized reps cause traditional enterprise renewals to plummet, finance will be forced to re-incentivize the sales floor.

3. Competitors Steal Market Share on Customer Relationships: When buyers get frustrated by constant rep turnover and chaotic internal processes, they eventually move their budgets to vendors with stable account teams.

These things ARE happening. But I don’t think Dell executives recognize the path they’re on. In 2-3 years, they will learn the error of their ways and attempt to reclaim market share, and customer and employee confidence.

Companies sometimes use indirect methods to reduce headcount while avoiding the costs, public scrutiny, and legal risks associated with traditional layoffs.

The approaches below are commonly discussed in this context. They are speculative, but patterns of behavior can be revealing: if it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, it may be a duck.

Volunteer Exit Plan
This offers a one-time lump-sum payment in exchange for an employee’s voluntary resignation. It has been used to encourage older employees with significant retirement benefits to leave the organization. In exchange for the payment, the employee typically waives the right to collect unemployment.

Quiet Firing
This involves deliberately creating a more difficult working environment so that employees either resign or can be terminated for performance reasons. Tactics may include raising performance standards, increasing workload, or issuing formal action-plan memos and documentation. The underlying dynamic is often an unspoken competition among peers. Higher performers are retained for the next phase of the business, while those who cannot meet the new expectations are managed out. Because the separation is framed as a performance issue, the employer generally avoids unemployment liability.

Constructive Discharge
This is closely related to quiet firing but focuses more on making the job untenable through changes in working conditions. Examples include significantly increasing required in-office time (for example, shifting someone from a hybrid schedule of one week per month in the office to near-full-time on-site attendance), altering hours, or reassigning them to a more demanding customer- or agent-facing role such as claims handling. These changes are often presented as positive realignment efforts intended to “help employees keep their jobs.” At the same time, companies may expand the use of business process outsourcing (BPO) firms or hire workers outside the country to lower costs and make it easier to eliminate roles later through automation.

The question that often arises is: if the goal were truly to retain employees, why invest so much effort in making their roles less sustainable?

Formal Termination
When the methods above do not produce the desired result, the company may ultimately terminate the employee. This is typically treated as a last resort because it carries unemployment costs and a higher risk of legal claims. It tends to occur when cost reduction, restructuring, or automation takes clear priority over retaining the individual.

When do you think they are going to start letting all the remote go?

All at once or in waves to avoid bad press?

I really think she handled that poorly and the way it was presented was short sighted. Why would you say something like that and then expect your remote or even hybrid workforce to even care about their jobs anymore.

Keep working and keep collecting that paycheck. Don’t resign just because they’re forcing RTO. If they want to push you out, make them go through the formal process, including a PIP if it comes to that. Managers hate dealing with PIPs because they’re awkward, time-consuming, and require documentation. Use that time to your advantage.

Resigning voluntarily can jeopardize your eligibility for unemployment benefits, so don’t make it easy for them. In the meantime, start applying for other jobs, guys.

I've noticed that a lot more people in Europe are being put on PIPs than in previous years. What's the reason for this, especially considering how difficult it is to fire employees in Europe?

Want to reduce LRs? Just promote terrible VPs who drive everyone to quit. It has to be the reason Cisco promotes people who are utterly clueless and have no track record of success to VP positions. The vile VP then lords over everyone, drunk on power, grinding the workforce into the ground. No severance required when people quit voluntarily. Genius.

I was PIPed. Absolutely crushed my PIP. Then RA'd during the following RA event. The RA cycle is a way for them to push out the PIP survivors. Unless you have a very strong network of lifelines in other parts of the company you are done at IBM.

Exactly what @jr+1m3jare07 said.

Here we go. Forced attrition to avoid severance packages right before the holiday
Go Evernorth. Bravo.

Looks like they are pushing recent hires outside for false excuses.... India powered Japanese company , this is NTT , You're welcome

:)

I was voluntold to accept "early retirement" in 2024. I had the pleasure of transferring knowledge to the offshore Accenture team prior to my "retirement".

What l noticed was that all Veterans of the US Armed forces in the department (myself included) were over 55 and pushed out the door.

I would be surprised if management knew or cared that the department kicked all Veterans to the curb.

That's my pre Veterans day message.

I was told that the new PMP system uses five ratings, from A to E, with E being the lowest.
Rumor has it that receiving two consecutive E ratings could lead to contract termination.

I was also told that in teams of five or more people, each rating must be assigned, regardless of whether all team members performed well.
I know this is supposedly about controlled and forced attrition aimed at eliminating so-called low performers, but it still shocks me.

In some cases, year-end ratings have apparently already been decided at the N+2 level. If that's true, then the game is rigged.

Your thoughts and comments will be valuable to everyone.

Skydance Media is implementing a mandatory five-day return to office policy across its various divisions. This policy affects Skydance Games, DC Comics, and other media holdings. The company is also offering a voluntary buyout program. These measures are intended to reduce headcount without explicitly announcing layoffs. This follows Skydance's recent $110 billion merger with Paramount and Warner Bros.

New York, NY

https://kotaku.com/skydance-institutes-company-wide-mandatory-return-to-office-so-it-can-avoid-saying-layoffs-so-soon-after-merger-2000749847

I have no insider information but another week and I keep seeing people across the board in the organization (mostly those who are financially independent or can afford to retire) writing good bye messages on LinkedIn or announcing retirement. 3 new cases again today, and I am one guy.

I understand that they over hired during the pandemic and need to slim down. However, this method of cutting people and pushing them to call it quits is going to hurt this company in the long run. We are being asked to operate as if some people who have been here for a while are not going to be around in Q1 next year. I don't think they'll need to do another RIF, they're counting on people quitting voluntarily.

Please share these types of developments of you are seeing them around you as well.

RTO changes as of 10/2/26. Employees will be mandatory in office 3 days a week minimum at risk of their career progression or their job

This is forced attrition at work

That's the post. That's the strategy.

I am part of the Splunk organization and our team has been handed over to the most toxic manager I have had in my entire working career. We couldn't tell if they were exceptionally stupid or if this was a strategy to get our entire team to quit without severance. On the .Conf floor, I learned there are other teams facing the same situation with their management. We've already had two folks quit that I have worked with for 10+ years. Did John Morgan instruct his management teams to find ways to get us all to quit so they don't have to pay out, or is the company culture to just hire trash directors now? Wondering how many other people are facing this.

On an earlier thread several asked for a repost of content paraphrased below:

For a career at the company, your performance vector has to be a net positive for 20 or 30 years. You can go up and down a bit around the middle bucket and be ok as long as you work hard and are diligent and a team player.

But if you drop and stay in lowest two buckets for more than two - four assessment cycles you should be concerned over perceptions of the perceived baggage you now carry as a perceived low relative performer longer term, as the unconscious bias of your rankers is very difficult to overcome.

With that backdrop, after the 2020 8-10 % MLRP program followed by 4q20 15 % voluntary and involuntary; there is net exodus of roughly 23 - 25 percent of your peer / ranking group on gross average in many instances.

So... what this now means to you is...In 5 months from now in May 2021 there is probably to be rationally expected between another 3-10 % MLRP program on top of this reduction in 2020.

So the end result in June of 2021 is roughly 26 - 35 % of your peers in your current rank group are no longer present after next rank cycle in 2021. Probably most of them that will have left the company populating the “ni” and “good” designated lower two quintiles.

So after May 2021 the ranking system and the math both requires any remaining ”Goods” to become “NI” or “NSI” and many “very goods” have to either become “Goods” and “NI” to make the math work on the forced rankings with quintile buckets still required.

Then fast forward and replay this into May 2022 - assume no layoffs but anything between a 3-10% MLRP process consistent with what happened this year.

If you think you are “very good” now you truly really are , but in the relative world of next rank cycles, on a relative ranking basis the “very goods” must have to mostly now become mostly “NI” and a some “goods” in just less than 18 months from now.

Math and forced rankings are hard to overcome the actual reality of how the game evolves for anyone ranked less than 50% because the usual 5–7-year progression of falling to lower quintile and outcome is now accelerated in the last year by the 23-25 % real reduction that occurred this year and another 3-10% that would potentially be exposed to MLRP and PIP in May 2021.

It is brutal system when expressed mathematically.

Best of luck with all future endeavors.

Any current “very goods” please really note , you are now at best “ni” or “good” in lowest two quintiles right now today as we step into next ranking cycle.

Don’t get mad at your bosses when they tell you this, just say you are smart and understand math. Don’t make them uncomfortable personally because they also know and disagree with the math, but they can’t say they disagree with the math.

It is what it is... no use being an a..hole when everyone knows math is math.

Have a financial plan already in play and always have other options in play. There is no long term loyalty so be the boss of your own destiny.

And you must unfortunately fully understand that when you drop into the bottom 25-30 percent there is really no recovery for you to have long-term career with the company.

It is sad to have to write this guidance. It was not like this 15 years ago.

Keep technical skills current and avoid going management track where most of your technical skills will become obsolete in 2-5 years.

New mechanical forced overtime policy of the week. You live here now! If you’re good and the director likes you, you may get to see your kids three hours a week (but only if they come to the shop). Now get to work you slaves! Oh, and your union said it’s okay!

Stack ranking is generally considered ineffective and destructive for long-term organizational success, though it remains popular for short-term cost-cutting and forced attrition.

Why does PayPal still do this? It cripples your organization. Any organization still stack ranking deserves their ultimate fate, fading away to oblivion!

USAA doesn't really lay off people as much anymore. They just make your life miserable until you leave quietly. Pay attention for a while and you'll see I'm right.

Is there a method that companies use to get people to leave?

4 days and 6-6 schedules didn’t push as many out

I just had a co-worker terminated Monday at mid-term. Also saw this once last year at mid-term. Looks like HR is making the call if you have a low performance review. Both employees had over seven years. Another quiet way Ford is removing employees.

I have been with the company for over a decade and until this year every single review has been meets or above. This year I got smacked with a below meets on my mid-year check in. Can they use this to terminate me without severance? I am fine with getting laid off but I want my package.

Another item for your reading pleasure. Doubtful that Stinkey has read this one.

https://enhancv.com/blog/rto-stealth-layoffs/?utm_source=chatgpt.com

Well, their plan is working. Over the last month two of my most talented colleagues have left for other firms. As predicted by every study, the forced attrition is working through departures of the most talented. The only folks being left behind are those that cannot leave, the CVX cultists, and the unhireable (which we have so so so many of). It’s like watching a company rot before your very eyes…

Is it just me or is there an active campaign to push out all of the upstream employees?

They are definitely going to micromanage people out so they don't have to pay! Getting a lawyer to be on standby. But if the PL can at least have a heart and stand up for us and know we will be out of y'all's hair asap and to please please not set us up to be let go. I have seen it happen too many times.
Noone cares. Trust my noone does.

Pretty much…if you don’t like it, leave.

I’m working on that, Gunjan, don’t worry.

It’s clear if you are remote or not in one of the main hubs, there is no longer any growth for you. They want you to leave.

So disheartening after years of dedicated work to just feel like I’m being pushed out!

What do the Attrition metrics for IT look like? I know its by design to get rid of Americans, but it seems much worse than anything ive seen.

At least not that I know of. If the whole ploy of being forced back into the offices to thin out the workforce (we all know that's the real reason) doesn't work out, are we looking at another major round sometime soon? How long are they going to wait to see if their plan is working?

Has anyone heard of GE HC "forcing" people to retire?

Heard some G8 were force to take a pay cut and become G7 and if they didn't accept those terms. They're gone and would not even get the severance package.

Yes, State Farm su-ks but half of complaining about “woke” and “customers” don’t even know what you’re complaining about. It’s greed at the of the day, they’re trying to make this place as miserable as they legally can to get people to quit without severance or even the voluntary exit offers. RTO su-ks, i don’t care how much you loved your office back in 1980, times have changes and there is literally nothing that we do at home that can’t be done from office (other than wasting hours of our life in traffic and pointless dribble chatter with coworkers), “customers” are the last thing on the executives mind, much less mine, they can read what they sign up for before they complain. Yes, I am actively looking for other places to work and I can’t wait to leave.

ExxonMobil’s MLRP is a performance‑ranking system that forces a fixed percentage of employees into the lowest category (“NSI”), often triggering PIP or separation options. It functions as a structured mechanism for performance management but has been widely criticized for effectively enabling layoffs under the guise of evaluation.

What the MLRP System Is
ExxonMobil’s Management and Leadership Review Process (MLRP) is an annual performance‑ranking system that categorizes employees into tiers. A key feature is the mandatory minimum percentage of employees placed into the lowest tier, Needs Significant Improvement (NSI). In 2020, ExxonMobil increased the required NSI share from 3% to 8%, expanding the number of employees exposed to performance‑based consequences.

Employees placed in NSI may be:

Forced to resign,

Placed on a Performance Improvement Plan (PIP), or

Given a Performance Improvement Leave (PIL)—a 3‑month paid separation option with benefits and outplacement services.

How the System Works in Practice

1. Forced distribution
   Managers must rank employees relative to peers, ensuring a fixed percentage fall into NSI. This is not purely performance‑driven; it is quota‑driven. Employees report that even strong performers can be pushed into NSI to meet the quota.

2. Consequences for NSI employees
   According to internal details shared by employees:

All NSI employees are subject to PIP or PIL.

Employees 40+ years old get 21 days to decide between PIP or PIL; those under 40 get 7 days.

All PIP/PIL programs must begin by September 1, with an off‑payroll date of December 1 for PIL.

1. Impact on newer employees
   Employees with less than two years at the company who fall into NSI are often asked to leave immediately.

Why the System Is Controversial
Employees and analysts argue that MLRP functions as a layoff mechanism, especially during downturns, despite ExxonMobil publicly stating it does not use the system to reduce headcount.

Reported concerns include:

Opaque criteria and limited feedback before being ranked low.

Morale damage, as employees feel they must “play the game” rather than focus on meaningful work.

Disproportionate impact on older or higher‑cost employees, aligning with broader cost‑cutting and offshoring strategies.

Summary Table
Aspect What It Means
Purpose Annual performance ranking and talent management
Key Feature Mandatory % of employees placed in NSI (raised to 8%)
Outcomes for NSI PIP, PIL, or forced resignation
Employee Concerns Quota‑driven cuts, morale issues, perceived covert layoffs
Company Position Claims system is for performance improvement, not layoffs

If you want, I can also break down PIP vs. PIL, explain how to navigate the system, or compare MLRP to other oil‑industry ranking systems.

Confirmed 5% RIF including Dinosaurs who would be forced to retire.

Always has been. Now with a side of gas price misery.

I am an NGINX Dev and I'm worried about my friend that works in F5 Digital. I can confirm forced resigns are happening in US and India. Be careful joining F5 Digital Team. If you've doubts, confirm with your friends at F5.

A lot of chatter around layoffs, but it seems that they are going to just starve out and fire folks in the B2B Mid Market space. Unattainable quotas, 30 day PIP process, calls for 75% of our time which limits finding real deals within our base. Over 22 years with the company, I cost more than most of my peers. I would be a natural layoff candidate. Would love to hang for a RIF, but I do not think they are ever going to let us go like that when they can get rid of us all free.

Anyone see it differently?

F5 started adopting forced resignations instead of layoffs. Recently did let go 22 members and no one is talking about it.

It's very hard to choose a person from your team.