Thread regarding VMware layoffs

"Republican prosecutors target corporate diversity programs:"

Yeah, they are also banning books, forcing girls to have kids and fighting culture wars. Of course they are against anything that will keep the usual majority - white males - from keeping their privileges.

Sounds like something done in Germany in the 30s-40s - look how well it ended for them.

"Riiiiiight. You know DEI is not just race, right?"

Say whatever you like, appologist, but we know that DEI is about everyone but a white guy. I know right from the recuiters mouths that there is a separate pile for the applications from white guys and it is set aside.

Yes we know DEI isn't just about race, which is why everyone makes other comments about se-ual preferences.

"We trained them for computer-based jobs where they could be paid for their brains and not their bodies. Yet, most couldn't land a second interview. Why shouldn't they deserve a better chance?"

So are you saying that they weren't hired or even get a 2nd interview because of their disability? There are many reasons people do not get jobs, and 99% of applicants are rejected, every time. This is my problem with DEI...you are arguing those people deserve an advantage because of the group you want to put them in, and insinuating they don't get jobs because of they are not part of another group you want to define. I highly doubt those candidates didn't get a 2nd interview because of their disability. Most people are not as callous and evil as you are insinuating. The fact they got a first interview shows they weren't discriminated against, which based off the other comments here, is all DEI programs are asking for.

DEI is racist and based on a false narrative.

Riiiiiight. You know DEI is not just race, right?

Gender, culture, religion, disabilities. I spent years working in a program training medically retired Army veterans with service-connected disabilities. Poor hearing, damaged eyesight, slurred speech, and prosthetic limbs. We trained them for computer-based jobs where they could be paid for their brains and not their bodies. Yet, most couldn't land a second interview. Why shouldn't they deserve a better chance?

DEI encompasses so much, but some people are so hung up on race...

White males need not apply!

"Properly run DEI is effective and makes a stronger business."

DEI is racist and based on a false narrative.

This!!!!

Republican prosecutors target corporate diversity programmes:

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-66209168

Telling my boss he is a racist because of his implementation of DEI sounds like a recipe for success!

VMware's issue is that it is being improperly implemented.

Part of the cult of DEI at VMware is that there is no space for criticism of the status quo policy in practice. Any criticism is met with swift condemnation. Great job Besty - go F yourself.

Yes, historically there was discrimination by white people against non-whites. Historically africans sold other africans into slavery. How far back would you like to go? Should we start grouping people of african descent based off their ancestral tribes, to undo that atrocity?

Speaking of red herrings ...

You are interpreting things in absolutes and assuming positions that are not being made. DEI does not mean only hiring URM. DEI means giving URM an equal and fighting chance at the role. Properly run DEI is effective and makes a stronger business. VMware's issue is that it is being improperly implemented. The argument I'm hearing here is to just throw it all away.

The goal should be to fix the implementation, not throw it all away as useless. This is happening at a VP level. Some do it horribly. Mine is very fair on this. If there is pushback on hiring a white male, I have previously shown the field of candidates, the hiring panel, and that every attempt was made to hire URM. The best pick was not a URM, and it was accepted.

I agree. We have our own issues at home. It impacts citizens of all colors.

And what about the dozens of homeless people I see every day on the streets in the US. Maybe focus on them vs. people a world away run by deeply corrupt - third world corrupt - government.

Wanna be a DEI Rock Star? Go help the 16 year old Indian girl, 8 months pregnant, subjugated to living on a blanket under a bridge because of her surname. Go to Thailand and help the woman who can't leave an abusive husband due to narcissistic cultural "tradition". Make a real impact on a family's life, and in the process gain an appreciation for what you have here before you destroy it

The DEI thing is just a desperate attempt to muddy the water. The most significant and far-reaching social tearing occur horizontally, but DEI introduces vertical rifts, aiming to mask and delay the eruption of horizontal societal ruptures.

So I would love for you to explain your grand plan on how we fix all these racial and gender disparities?

The algorithm looks to be that it is required that every job category reflects the exact racial proportions of our society.

See how stupid that sounds? Yet that is the rationale.

"historically is never about meritocracy and more about the hiring manager perceiving better skill in people that look like themselves. That's why DEI was designed."

Your statement is a red herring to distract from the fact that you are arguing for blatant and open discrimination based off grouping people by their skin color or gender, vs their skills, abilities, and experience.

Yes, historically there was discrimination by white people against non-whites. Historically africans sold other africans into slavery. How far back would you like to go? Should we start grouping people of african descent based off their ancestral tribes, to undo that atrocity?

Do you understand you are arguing for discriminatory practices as a way to remedy past discriminatory practices? This is not the way you fix the problem.

Let me ask you another question. There are industries in the sciences where women are overrepresented vs men. Are you worried about equal representation there? Or how about construction jobs, where men are 90+% of the workforce? Should they have a DEI program, or can we just accept that most women dont currently want to work in construction? Black people are overrepresented in professional sports like basketball and football, do you think the NBA and NFL should have DEI programs to make sure white or even latinos are not discriminated against? Where does this stop?

So I would love for you to explain your grand plan on how we fix all these racial and gender disparities?

Had a friend apply for a job at vmw. Skillset was exactly what they were looking for. They were bypassed - didn't even get an interview. I later found out that it was a "DEI opening" and being a white, middle aged American male, he did not meet the criteria.

This kind of discrimination should not be allowed.

more about the hiring manager perceiving better skill in people that look like themselves. That's why DEI was designed.

And VMware’s implementation is quite far from addressing that concern!

“Hey hiring manager . Our team doesn’t have enough of X, and I’m compensated based on getting more of X, so hire X.”

Been there, done that!

“But that isn’t the way it is supposed to work”

And yet the system Betsy created is exactly that in practice.

Employers should discriminate on the basis of skill, aptitude and experience, and nothing else.

That's getting into the red herring of hiring off meritocracy. Sounds great, but historically is never about meritocracy and more about the hiring manager perceiving better skill in people that look like themselves. That's why DEI was designed.

I wonder if HR is concerned about equal representation for each eye and hair color too. Breaking people down into groups will be endless exercise in futility.

The problem with DEI is it openly encourages and incentivizes discrimination!!!!

It operationalizes the categorization of people into groups, vs treating everyone as an individual.

Employers should discriminate on the basis of skill, aptitude and experience, and nothing else.

If an employer is NOT hiring someone because of their gender or race they should swiftly punished! If an employer is HIRING someone based off their gender or race, they should be dealt with in the same way!

DEI was NOT Martin Luther Kings dream! A color and gender blind world was!

you blame DEI for your issues

Nope. I’m fine. Doing great. The company policies are fûcked.

If you are not on the top, that's not because of DEI

You totally miss the whole point of it all.

Enjoy living in your fantasyland I guess?

If you're good at your job, then you're good. You have no concerns.

If your day is stressing over the work being done by everyone around you, then you may not be as good at your job as you think.

The implication that one must be bad at your job in order to criticize DEI efforts is quite laughable.

I’m rubber, you are glue, whatever you say bounces of me and sticks to you.

There, now that is a more intelligent argument to make.

"It will be wonderful to see you whiners about DEI having no one to blame for your failures when Broadcom takes over and let you go. Who are you going to blame for your problems then? "

What are you saying here, exactly? You appear to be a mo--n

People who are bad at their jobs are trying to stay on top by blaming problems on DEI. When Broadcom takes over, everyone will be held accountable, and you can't blame it on the boogeyman of the day.

That's how I read it.

"It will be wonderful to see you whiners about DEI having no one to blame for your failures when Broadcom takes over and let you go. Who are you going to blame for your problems then? "

What are you saying here, exactly? You appear to be a mo--n

I don’t blame anyone for my problems.

I blame stupid people for the problems they create, especially while mounted on a moral high horse.

I’ll be gone by then because I won’t work for private equity style firm, but if I did stay I would not miss the PE approach when it comes to hiring.

The PE approach is simple - do you know your sh-t, do you work hard, and do you know your sh-t?

Nothing else matters, not your volunteer work for native Alaskans who identify as gender fluid Vikings.

So go find some other company that support your racist hiring practices while you can. That racist practice that the Supreme Court just struck down will find its way to corporate hiring soon enough - and not a day too soon.

Go Hock - unleash the Kraken!

It will be wonderful to see you whiners about DEI having no one to blame for your failures when Broadcom takes over and let you go. Who are you going to blame for your problems then?

It's wonderful that URMs want jobs in software, the problem is most are not in any way qualified. Fix the education system and revisit this 22 years later. In the meantime Broadcom will stop it. Broadcom has no patience for DEI.

Each town-hall meeting, each all-hands it is about DEI. No word on Employee Net Promoter Score.

With an ENPS at 25 & 34 (depending quarter) this is the worst I ever seen at a company I worked before.

And if you go looking for it, you might find ENPS on the internal HR site. But no worries, it is all blamed on the acquisition. But even before the Broadcom announcement, EPNS was below the 50 target .

DEI is just used to hide the problems and concerns of the majority.

This is discrimination plain and simple! Treat people as individuals Betsy!

“Their efforts are to improve the ratio of women globally, as well as URM within the States.

US African American/Black
US American Indian/Alaska Native
US Hispanic/Latino
US Native Hawaiian/Pacific Islanders

These URMs might be under represented with regard to their percentage of the population but they are not under represented with regard to their desire or ability to do this kind of work.

The whiners talking about "wokeness" will have a great time finding a new job. You should actually walk the talk and just look for companies that hire people like you. Twitter has a boss that is anti-woke... oh but he just like firing everyone. Oh well.

Why should hiring managers assume any "URM" was ever hired for any reason other than their color or se-ual proclivities? Like with users of pronouns it is natural (and wise) to assume that none of these people have the necessary knowledge or experience and avoid them. This is the future once America finally passes the kidney stone of wokeness.

told by my VP that any promotion in my small croup would HAVE to be a URM if its going to get approved and not make the VP look bad in their stats.

Same story on my side. Nothing puts me in a more inclusive mood than hearing you must hire a person of X race or s-x before starting the hiring process

Yea

Go team

“Oh, it isn’t supposed to be that way” folks not involved with the process say.

Welcome to the real world. Glad the Supreme Court reversed affirmative action for college. Hopefully that will become the same policy for hiring.

"Indian employees are not underrepresented minorities,"

My point exactly! You just made it. I was not allowed to promote a White male. I was specifically told by my VP that any promotion in my small croup would HAVE to be a URM if its going to get approved and not make the VP look bad in their stats.

BUT, They can have an entire leadership team built of White and idian men, with a woman or 2 tossed in. You are correct. They are not URM, but they have no problem taking the C and VP level positions then pushing rules down on us that dont match...

Please dont argue DEI with me. I have lived with it since the beginning and understand its history, its business implications, the CSG scores that relate to the markets.

Not much gets deleted from here, but personal insults (towards individuals or groups) are not allowed.
Thing is - once we start talking about DEI heated back and forth on race and ethnicity starts within a seconds, and a few minutes after bunch of posts crossing the line appears. When that happens (this is just my two cents), shutting down the whole thread is easier than cherry picking what to keep and what to delete, so that's what the site mods probably do .

As for the thread in question, I can't say that I'm shocked it got nuked so quickly, as it did have the word "hate" right in the middle of its title, so the thread it self kinda broke the site rules.

Indian employees are not underrepresented minorities, so I'm not sure why you call that out. VMware has good, clear documentation on this. Their efforts are to improve the ratio of women globally, as well as URM within the States.

US African American/Black
US American Indian/Alaska Native
US Hispanic/Latino
US Native Hawaiian/Pacific Islander

Some are also confused between URM and best-cost hiring, where hiring from India and Bulgaria is preferred as they are lower cost than US. But if you didn't know that, it would look like DEI.

Maybe threads are being deleted because people are hating on something that they have zero understanding of?

Yeah; I'd like to get a backend peek at the principals behind this site and learn a little more about how they operate.