Thread regarding Intel Corp. layoffs

The 2025 surprise might be that Floundry is not spun off, but made profitable then broken up.

IDM 1.0 Product groups benefited from having access to lead nodes (ahead of what other companies could access), to the point that the fabs were run as a loss-leader, with max emphasis on output and yield over cost.

This led Finance to grind their teeth but no one cares about that.

It seems clear that external customers want Floundry to be a separate company from Products, because of the concern over IP sharing and wafer start conflicts.

But that leaves Product groups with low margins when they rely on lead nodes from TSMC. This is because they no longer have pricing power and that will only worsen over time as x86 is supplanted by ARM.

So Product groups NOW need Floundry to be a more cost effective supplier TSMC (and close to leading node). This was the point of IDM 2.0.

MJ tried to mumble something about this in a more positive light, but the reality seems clear enough.

What this likely means is deep cuts in Floundry spending, as that group gets real about the capacity needed for the pace of customer onboarding which is possible.

The pushout of Ohio and halting of other projects shows the effort is underway to rationalize capacity to demand.

Pat was pushing to do a full buildout, which only made sense if he was able to bring high volume customers onboard.
A smarter approach would have been to do no greenfield projects.
Just add a few mods and wait for customer growth to justify Ohio and Germany.
This is what appears to be the current plan (much to Pats deep chagrin)

Next is to slow down the ramp, and stop building speculative capacity.
The company has being driven into the ground by reckless expansion and it must stop.

So at the existing facilities, that means fewer tools, which means less headcount. Attrition may be sufficient.

It seems possible that a few HVM fabs could be spun off into an independent company, to satisfy external customer concerns.
Considering how few customers there are, that could just be at one site, like Ireland or something.

For Product groups, it is way past time to stop projects and groups that have no roadmap to profitability.
Because that x86 market share, it ain't coming back.

If Product groups need the combined margins then they will have to retain some fabs in the same company, and likely TD as well, in order for it to be funded.

So the big surprise of 2025 may be that the company is not particularly broken up, but that the fabs are broken up, in order to sustainably serve the needs of internal and external customers.


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| 1811 views | | 14 replies (last August 4) | Reply
Post ID: @OP+1jgw8g0nv

14 replies (most recent on top)

Try not to be surprised when the surprising thing happens as expected, and is surprising.

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Post ID: @xya+1jgw8g0nv

Looks like TD is about to be cut down to size, having taken only small reductions in the current layoff action.

That has the mark of Ryan Russell, and Ann to some extent, always pushing for more staff. As if 9000 people were going to be 8x better than 1000 people.

TD may be the most egregious case of empire building in the company, and certainly is where the foundry losses are coming from.

Fabs are overstaffed partly because TD forced them to install too many tools, as part of the persistent overcapacity fab model TD has always pushed.

The history of this goes back to the 1990s, when there were times that Intel couldn't fill all the demand. But for at least the past 10 years, capacity has been causing excess cost.

The only way to fix it at this point is to sell some fabs and maybe try to sell some of the excess tools, or do both.

Foundry + TD could easily see 50% headcount reduction from the current level.

I think LBT and the Board are committed to doing just that, and pushing out any VP who resists.

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Post ID: @xp6+1jgw8g0nv

@OP Will IFS adopt a flounder fish as their mascot?

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Post ID: @xna+1jgw8g0nv

Bumping this one back to the top, for the 3 actual Intel fab workers on this site, who somehow still can't figure it all out.

Keep in mind, OP posted this in Jan, before LBT was CEO.

You literally heard it here first. LBT is gonna do an Eddie Lampert on Intel, with a blue-light special on some fabs coming up shortly.

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Post ID: @xhh+1jgw8g0nv

@6az+1jgw8g0nv If anything like those rumors is what is going on, then IFS continues and it is the Product side which is being sold off.

Broadcom is talking takeover, not taking a stake.

The article suggests that the goal is to help fund the Intel ramp to new nodes, and speed up the onboarding of customers.

That seems a lot more feasible than TSMC buying IFS, but either way IFS desperately needs to restructure and stop having so much non-centralized fab groups. It's just d-mb.

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Post ID: @6b0+1jgw8g0nv

TSMC Might Acquire 20% Stake In Intel's Intel Foundry Services (IFS) Business, Says Report

https://wccftech.com/trump-administrations-made-in-america-push-could-see-intel-sell-20-of-foundry-business-to-tsmc-report/

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Post ID: @6az+1jgw8g0nv

This is insane and will never happen this month!

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Post ID: @66s+1jgw8g0nv

I can't wait for the Make Floundry Again Great hats!!!

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Post ID: @28z+1jgw8g0nv

Looks like this is what is happening, right now.

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Post ID: @24n+1jgw8g0nv

Well duh, that's the whole point of spinning it out, so it can eventually be a standalone. Any publicly held company is potentially for sale. Biz101

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Post ID: @ys+1jgw8g0nv

Oh Geeze someone’s still drinking eggnog.

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Post ID: @k9+1jgw8g0nv

Prodco engineers coming up various permutations of a company without TD when instead they should be thinking about their useless roadmap and out of date products.

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Post ID: @bd+1jgw8g0nv

All of HVM (except Ronler) could be spun off into an independent company or at least turned into a subsidiary. That may be enough separation for external customers.

Product groups could keep TD and the rest of Ronler, and that would improve margins and provide the funding needed to remain close to lead node.

Intel could then do a technology Joint Venture with the then-independent foundry business, to pass on new nodes. This is like what IBM does with GF.

An independent foundry business could even merge with Samsung, although that might face regulatory issues.

Seems clear enough that there are sustainable ways to do this, and that the only thing that is not sustainable is the current strategy.

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Post ID: @a3+1jgw8g0nv

Keep in mind that only Apple consistently uses TSMC leading node.

That's because their die are small and they have pricing power, so their margins can afford the much higher cost of being on the leading node.

In a sense, Apple is now doing what Intel used to do. They do have a walled garden but eventually the competition or regulation will break through that.

NVDA has less of a competitive moat and really relies on TSMC newer nodes to stay ahead. That is a fight they will eventually lose.

Every tech company is constantly trying to build or maintain a competitive moat and that is a profitable way to analyze who comes next.

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Post ID: @a2+1jgw8g0nv

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