Thread regarding Wells Fargo & Co. layoffs

Big difference between a "non-performer" and a "high performer that is now just doing the bare minimum because he's mad at his manager".

Sounds like the OP here is in the second catagory.

@1xgn+1hrW5XPd

Nice work and congrats! Hate to think about the amount of money we wasted on that guy.

I wouldn't call working on your own stuff when you're supposed to be working for us a "side hustle".

@1kwz+1hrW5XPd Sure did. All of the MyED reports that showed him MIA were run for the entire team. He was the only one not showing up to meetings, not delivering assignments on time but we looked at the whole team to see if he was an outlier.

Funny enough, he himself said he was busy with his “side hustle” when he was missing for a full day which is what sent other people on the team looking at the website he built while he should have been working.

Nice try though - you clearly haven’t dealt w/ HR on these matters who actually do challenge the managers quite a bit to avoid favoritism and grudges.

can they and do they fire with little lead up? Yes. Is it the norm? No

I was top 10 in the country in our division and was fired with no warnings, write ups, etc. It can happen to anyone. More people need to understand that these corporations don’t see us as humans.

@ @1xgn+1hrW5XPd (Firing Manager)
Do you spend the same amount of time scrutinizing all your other employees as you spend on the one you say is not working or improving? Because, if I were him (and who is to say I am not) I would be watching for any and all situations where you are disfavoring me over the rest of the team. That's called harassment and if it can be well documented, you might have a major problem firing a person and they might just get a lawyer.

(1) At each work completion, reassign your work to Chinese nationals on H1b

(2) Remove you from any meetings and QRM account, but assign you QRM work - requiring you to "borrow" an account.

(3) Give you zero training on assignment, require complete knowledge extraction for H1b workers just graduated from China

These will do the trick, company and KPMG will label you as old and outdated, results guaranteed in most financial companies I know.

If you're doing the bare minimum and not trying to help your boss, you SHOULD be fired. What do your co-workers think of your slacking?

Firing manager here. I had a legit non-performer. The guy hardly ever even logged on to the VPN - he claimed it was internet issues until we saw his Facebook and side business website activity during business hours. He hadn’t disclosed the side business - that turned into a conflict of interest investigation with HR. He essentially said he was sorry and they said “ok”!

Still getting no actual work done because not actually logging in for more than 3-4 hours a day (and those were long days). Down the old HR performance management route. 6 months of write ups, HR meetings, enduring every excuse and accommodation under the sun while the team picks up all the slack.

Finally time for written warning - yes, 6 months of verbal and the chance to improve before written - and he gets indignant about being written up! Has no rationale for why he didn’t make an iota of improvement from the verbal warnings, has nothing to offer for why he can’t stay logged in for more than 2-3 hours per day other then “the network kicked me off”. So, in a huff, he says he’d rather just quit. Bye, Felicia.

That was 2021 - now, they toss you into does not meet or needs improvement and when your group gets hit with layoffs you top the list.

My manager has been trying to fire someone for years and it's practically impossible

why wf and any other company cam fire you at will they typically won't due to fear of litigation and have processes in place to mintigate these risks. have seen the process and gone though it with a bad employee it takes a lot of time and as stated you get informal waning, then a period of time to improve (30-60days) then a pip if you still aren't better then another period of time (30-60days), followed by termination. unless you get laid off or do something against policy like looking at po-n at work or harassing others it will take time. if your manager hasn't put you on an informal warning, which is documented with HR, you are fine. if you get an informal warning or pip you probably have upwards of a few months.

There are steps they have to go through. Verbal warning, written warning, PIP. They can’t “just” fire you with no warning because they don’t like the look on your face. They have to build a case, unless it’s for cause.

Layoffs are different. That comes down from above.

They have to have all their ducks in a row to prove the termination is legitimate before they'll go through with it.

However, on the "I just got fired" side, you'll be told in person and security will show up to escort you out of the building.

They can fire you at any time but they call it a layoff now. If you’re older or don’t hit the right diversity buttons, especially if your manager is not born here, you are always prone to be on the hit list.

This may get downvoted but facts are facts regardless of your politics, which has nothing to do with this. It’s about that green salad of corporate greed.

Most likely he will have you listed as his first option for displacement. Just wait it out and you might get a package.

You are forgetting the flip side of that, of course. You can also just quit an employer. At any time, with no notice. Just Hey, I quit. Or just don't show up one morning. It's a beautiful thing to not be stuck with an employer, nor an employer stuck with an employee.

If you unfortunately, "live" in the US empire, then it a very "exceptional" place. Because it's the only country in the world that has the employment at will-whim doctrine. The corporation can fire you at anytime for no reason, or any reason (other than se-ual orientation, s-x, race, national origin, handicap). Other than that, the corporation has all the power to sht can you for no reason at any time. Your breath smell, you're gone, you like rock, they like classical, you're gone. You dig? Basically, usa = cesspool

Can you give a year notice of retirement or would that put you on the “layoff” list?

File a complaint against your manager for ageism. Document what you can. In this place, your manager will have to prove innocence but anything after that they get on you about you can then play the retaliation card.

Document everything your nutty manager sends you via email. Print to pdf and keep it in a folder.
On a daily or every other day basis, provide your manager your list of accomplishments and ask "what can I do better to earn a Meets?" You have to ask almost all the time and if no response, that "manager" isn't doing his job.
Be ready with a list of infractions that your manager makes over the next few months until you retire. Put them in a narrative and you can submit that as your exit interview when you leave.

Anyone can be laid off with no notice but a phone call is what I've heard. You'd get a call from your manager that you need to talk. That is the same regardless of whether or not you get along with your manager.

If you are not on a PIP by now, you’re not going to get fired before you retire. Your manager has decided waiting you out is the easiest option.

If you’re a complainer and document well, then you will never get fired. Your manager’s life is also a living he-l as a result of you. I would recommend he look for some individual contributor jobs where he will make more anyways and then be able to get away from you.

As for you, stop being stubborn and get a different job as well. Your life is currently he-l as well. But the power is all in your hands if you keep complaining, he’s terrified of you, and you will win this.

I'd have to check the employee handbook, but as far as I know they can fire you for cause -- like job abandonment, stealing, policy violations etc. I'd think they could fire you for insubordination. Now, bear in mind they could fire you for even a minor policy violation. I've seen it happen at another company for a minor expense policy violation.

If it's something like a performance type of thing, then I think you'd have to get a certain rating and likely go on an improvement plan. They could also eliminate your position I suppose. For performance issues, they'd have to write up why.

And that said, I'd think companies typically cover their butts on certain types of termination b/c they don't want a law suite for wrongful termination. Now, I'm not sure how that plays out in an at-will state since I think in that case they can terminate you for any reason they want, or no reason at all.