How many people will be lay off through PIP this year?
5508 replies (most recent on top)
Hmmm … statistically:
That will result in the chi-square distribution going awry and playing push-pull on the confidence interval estimation for a population standard deviation of a normal distribution, from a sample standard deviation.
The 8% in NSI will be a heartburn to many - not only for those impacted (and have to be PIP’d, regardless), but also their immediate supervisors / managers.
It is not easy for any boss to agree on whom in his/her team should fill the bottom 8% - even if everyone had done their best …….. and for many, even better than their prior, 2020 performance.
But it’s just too bad. HR had mandated that the bottom 8% must be enforced - based on RELATIVE performance …….. even if everyone had performed superlatively.
So take note that the PA distribution is not a “normal” one (i.e. peaking in the middle), but it has to compensate for the “offset” already made for more spaces in the better-than-outstanding category - to incentivise the top performers.
So it’s really a leveraging game conjured to “re-balance” everything back in the middle, (only) from the statistical mean standpoint, but not necessarily the median! It’s just way too simplistic a model lah, thought out by (non-mathematical) simple minds!
Results should be out by July. Ranking is mostly done in June.
When is PIP date this year ?
And why is that so? Is because of the ranking (now PA) system. Voice your disgruntled views and unhappiness, and you will end up in 5th quintile, or NSI in no time.
So, akin to the Eastern Bloc era of the pre-90s, people live in continuous fear and suppression - as otherwise, their jobs, income, family and livelihood are at stake!
So STFU, do your job well and tie the line - that will guarantee that you will not lose your job.
@4Nhsi+16zEvLP3
This! Truer words have never been spoken. What EM has trained her people so well is to be two-faced liars. You'll never find peace when your actions and inner thoughts don't align.
What the shxt is this Engineering VP talking about?
Bro, introducing your wife to everybody here in the forum doesn't ease the anxiety and desperation and disappointment of the upper EM management and your local puppets.
Sc--w it.
Don’t confuse layoff board rants with reality, workers come here to KPKB, but still go back to work hard and to compete to win.
Should be outstanding with distinction leadership? Because outstanding just don’t cut it anymore, especially for our inspiring managers who’s doing their best to push us out the doors so that the corporation can obtain structural savings!
Where is the attrition? People I worked with 1 year ago are still around, and we are still winning!
Praise our outstanding SG leadership for bringing SG EM to greater heights!!!
@4Mmha+16zEvLP3 After working hours and weekends are for job searching. Where got time to OT?
Same colleagues knock off on time, no OT and not working during weekend. Overloaded and organization is very lean now? I doubt so...
All my colleagues are still around, so I don’t know where the attrition is coming from. I guess that’s why management didn’t give a damn too.
@4Lugr+16zEvLP3
That’s an interesting management concept, straight out of a Peter Drucker book!
You are confusing big time lah, my fierce friend, between a manager and a leader.
What you’ve just described are merely supervisors being effective managers - doing their LPSAs and LPO QR/V&Vs right off the books.
But not all managers make good leaders.
Leadership qualities are strong, charismatic attributes that only certain managers possess, which can “move nations”. This, when coupled with experience, knowledge, vision and empathy, is what exists in some of our T2 DHs, that the company cannot just let go of them now!
4Lssi+16zEvLP3
Good leadership their farking azz lah
Yah only very good at interfering delaying the real worker bees job by asking the same repeated continuous non stop stupid id--t questions whats the worst thing can happen and fault finding lpo reports and penalise employees fail competency level
Like this called good leadership ah
My unit ex bangla general worker also can do his same job carbon copy at cheaper rate some more
Really dunno WTF is happening to em here in SG
God pls have mercy on us all
Long story short - Singaporean worker buay kan, so can’t expect too much. EM has fed you too well for too long. Now we can’t afford too many T3 freeloaders.
Dude the T2s are the good for nothing managers. If they're any good they won't be asking sheet load of questions.
There is some truth there.
Singapore is deemed uncompetitive due to our high salary structure and benefits. It all boils down to SGCX’s manufacturing “cost to produce”.
And that is why EM HR:
- is re-assessing our salary scales against the basket of other related companies (though I’m not sure about the Thai HR manager conspiracy theory)
- has removed some benefits like country club fee subsidies, interest-free vehicle loans, etc.
- has renegotiated our medical insurance plans to wean off 100% coverage above the previous $5K/yr (single) and $10K/yr (family) OOPs.
Qualifier: Singapore has become too costly to operate in, for many industries - so it’s not an EM-unique problem. Many MNCs had upstick from here over the past few decades - to shift to cheaper 3rd world countries to build their plants and factories there.
On the subject of laying off the working level first, during a time of crisis - where the company’s cash flow is so deeply net-negative, ain’t that the best way to keep the company afloat and keep the experience and knowledge (in Tier-2s) intact, to fight another war?
At the end of the day, we can always re-hire to fill the vacuum in the ranks, when the business swings back to normalcy! Fresh grads can be trained and skilled to takeover the vacant jobs.
But if the experience and knowledge (soul) of T2s are all gone at the top, these are just irreplaceable.
DH told me that the only folks that matter are T2 and above...due to their strong leadership to ensure SG stays competitive...anyone else is easily replaceable.
I could not believe my ears and how detach they are...but seeing the inaction from SG Mgt....i believe that is how the upper SG mgt thinks as a whole.
I started job hunt after hearing that comment...and after 2 months found a better paying job.
I really feel sorry for those who remain if SG mgt continues this path....
According to management, it’s the workers who are uncompetitive, and adding to the untenable cost structure. But management is super competitive.
PUI!!!
4Kgjl+16zEvLP3
Your logic is absolutely spot on
Anyway let the company axe the good hardworking very critical sales and frontliners the more the faster the better lah coz we are trash for them
I believe these axed people will be more highly deserved valued and appreciated elsewhere
Let company continue to keep the highly prized valuable fanciful high cost high maintenance administrators presenters and story tellers the longer the better
Yes this company is self charting heading leading itself to slow but surely inevitable death...RIP soon em
Actually you just need more sales and front line pple working in the market. We don’t need L2s and above . These layers are basically administrators . They generate tons of work for reporting upwards but actually they don’t have no much economics contribution. They are high cost , high maintenance, playing politics and taking time away from ground troops ( to generate presentations and data for them to wordsmith and report upward- ie doing the song and dance) from working the market. Unfortunately , the company is stupid enough to axe the worker bees and keep these groups of story tellers around… what do u think is the ending of this story ? The inevitable death…..
Plus there’s way too many people working in F&L. You have a manager, then director and so many different layers which I’m not sure where the value is. All just for selling petrol and lubricants. And after so many going to Shopee, we still have way too many layers of management left. I don’t know what they do; other than to report up to Ian. And basically parroting what’s already said by the Gods in Houston/Dallas. Oh, F&L also contributed local LCMs, but the current one is hopeless!
Even without COVID, it's only a matter of time before the company goes into its slow decline. We're always shown charts of how oil and gas will remain an integral part of the energy mix for decades, but the truth is even if volumes don't shrink overnight, the key drivers of profitability are disappearing. Fossil fuels once had a monopoly on energy, but margins are going to become razor thin as alternatives become way cheaper and developed countries race to net zero. It's time to go gently into that good night.
Folks , many of the young ones still don’t get it? The company will be in “ slow steaming “ mode sailing into sun set . If such is the end game, what bench strength, career development, developing younger generation are we talking about? Basically we will be on survival mode, until the day the market obsolete us ( can u see the train coming fast?) . I will be d-mb wood to stay around to be used as a Swiss kn--e by all these older mgrs and execs to do all the dirty works till the time I dig myself deep in this Shole that I can’t keep my relevance outside EM… I finally found a ticket of exit will be throwing my letter soon. I have decided short term pain over long term gain. The Mgmt needs to be answerable for the state of the company today … It’s sad , once a great company…. But lost its plot …. I lost the pride of wearing its logo over my chest these days , I know it’s time to go! Take care , those left behind . May peace be with u .
@4Jskd+16zEvLP3
How could you have suspected?
What made you think that way?
Were you present in the PA process, when your supervisor actually read out your 2 minute summary and purposely left out segments - to keep those credits for herself ?
Another fake, who is trying to stir sh!t in this forum?
CL27 was many years back.
@4Jeek+16zEvLP3
You a DH (or higher)?
Has to be … in order to be present in a CL26/27 ranking / PA process, to be able to “see” ICs compared against SLSs !!!
Wah, you very daring to come here comment hor.
Or perhaps you are a fake?
I suspect that I had a boss who did not read out everything I stated in my PDS because she wanted to use some of those things I did for herself. Wondering if this is common?
I haven’t seen a case where the subordinate is ranked higher than his/her boss in the ranking or PA process, and I have sat through many sessions.
With TMTS, the intention to keep people in the position longer, like 5 yrs, including leaders, advisors, managers, all the move and promotion will slowdown. And also those hipo looking and waiting to be expatriate to US, chance also lower, at slower pace, why need to send out exposure, the manager will be here 5yrs, not like last time, 2-3yr. Big picture is all move will slowdown, for personal wealth and young folks, it make sense to look out alternatives.
By the time a NON hi-po reaches CL26/27, how would he/she be assessed in the PA, against the SLSs (where many are hi-pos)?
These former are the individual contributors, holding positions like complex, advisors, EMRE, lead coordinators, anchors, etc.
How will they be “ranked” against the SLSs who are in the management ladder? Will there really be no unconscious bias against the ICs during the PA comparison process?
How would you rank a CL26 Complex, against his/her own CL26 SLS supervisor, in the same PA cohort?
Can we ever have a direct subordinate assessed to be in a PA category HIGHER than his/her own boss?
The previous hi-pos who were sent for overseas assignment have returned to SG and occupied the good positions, leaving no chance for the new hi pos.
Then many lateral movement will happen but no actual development of people. Simply becoz there is no such openings.
Crashing against each other, thru PIP.
Interesting.
There’s no career planning for anyone except for the hi-po. So wish you all the very best in your job search. Unless you find joy in becoming the statistic for NSI or PIP when you are older.
I thought I was alone when I was told that I had to rotate to other BU/BT for career development. To me, it is just extending my contract to a job while the other chosen ones are developed.
Thanks for the perspective
@4Ipif+16zEvLP3
@4Iynj+16zEvLP3 Moral of the story is to constantly seek for career progression opportunities outside of EM. This is especially true for new hires.
No one owes you a career and when sh-t hits the fan, you are on your own, that is what we learnt since the pandemic started.
Based on your ranking (now PA) results for the first many years on the job, they will deem you as management, or technical ladder.
Once slotted into either pathway, only the high-po ones in management ladder will have a career development plan made out for them, as they get promoted to become the future managers.
For the rest of us, we can LL s-u-c-k thumb and get kicked around to fill lower MPT positions. For this lot, we will flounder in the sea of CL25 and below for quite a while, with a glass ceiling of CL27 as you age into your 50s. There is really no plan for you, Jose.