Hopefully being on strike and losing over a month of wages wasn't in vain.
This has come full circle and this being mediated by FMCS. Must he pretty embarrassing and the union leaders will need to save face.
Feel bad for everyone all all around. Especially for those on strike. You have made the sh-- of all sh-- lists.
US EWA folk will be just fine. We have accepted status quo. RIF would be nice knowing not to go through this again.
Hopefully they don't f--- us out of severance.
I was hired by MCI nearly 20 years ago.... there was no union at MCI, so I never signed up for this....we were bought up by VZ. My job is implementation engineering, has ZERO to do with managing associates, never did. But they didn't hesitate to pull me into this.... I'm about ready to move on, because working for VZ feels like working for gov't, but don't want to walk away from 36 weeks of severance pay-would you? If they RIF me tomorrow, I'd throw a party then look for another job... already started looking, but has to be a real sweet offer to leave nearly $80,000 gross, $60,000 net on the table. Peace
"I stand corrected. You are right! The management classification has been changed to cover those without employees reporting directly to you. But I still argue that all of us are a function of the number of circuits in service. If the 36,000 workers on strike were reduced that would affect the number of management positions, no matter if you have reporting employees or not."
This is probably true, only on the portion of the landline business that deals with POTS, Specials, etc etc. But, there is another completely different part of the company (even within VZT, never mind VZB and VZW) that the number of so called "managers" are not directly related to union headcount. In fact, these folks never even see a union member. With EWAs now though, they have become acutely aware that the union in fact exists!
I stand corrected. You are right! The management classification has been changed to cover those without employees reporting directly to you. But I still argue that all of us are a function of the number of circuits in service. If the 36,000 workers on strike were reduced that would affect the number of management positions, no matter if you have reporting employees or not.
@HsGpPRH-cgc You can believe whatever you want to believe.
Seems like a nerve was hit! Yep… there are positions in this company that do not require the union… just people. It doesn’t matter where they are… US, India, Mars. And like @inp said… the union rules just makes bau life more difficult than it has to be.
"Many so called "management" positions do not involve supervision of union personnel at all."
Yes, so true.
@UBQ- A little imagination is all it takes to come up with some functions that are not headcount dependent. I’m sure there’s a system or systems associates use to service customers (order entry, maintenance ticket entry, etc)…. You need a certain number of programmers to maintain them regardless of how many use it. Same with personnel management systems, reporting systems, etc. There has to be a call routing group… with a company as big as Verizon, I would imagine their headcount is dictated more by hours of operation than associate headcount.
"Here's a clue, starting with the number of customers or circuits in service governs the staffing levels of all our jobs. Each level above the customer level is a function of the positions below. In other words, less associates less management."
That is only true for a portion of the actual management jobs within VZ. Many so called "management" positions do not involve supervision of union personnel at all.
Remember that, for better or worse, the company is not the "phone company" anymore.
You can't be serious! How the hell did someone with your logic become management ?
Here's a clue, starting with the number of customers or circuits in service governs the staffing levels of all our jobs. Each level above the customer level is a function of the positions below. In other words, less associates less management.
@mat .... it ain't crap. What folks do not understand is these EWA for the most part are educated and in high tech fields. They understand from the git-go that they will not retire from the first company they ever worked for. They fully understand that they will change jobs 3 or 4 times in their career and during that time will likely change the type of job they do. Every manager and every EWA I have spoken with acknowledges this and folks I know outside of VZ are of the same view.
This new breed of employee comes to work know they will stay 4 or 5 or 6 years at one job, build skills, network with people and have a 401k with other investments.
When they say they don't mind getting RIF'd they are serious.
"Remember the number of management positions are tied directly to the number of union associates."
for me and the manages I come in contact with, it's not the number of UNION associates... it's the number of associates. so, as far as we're concerned, it doesn't matter if the associates are union or not... also, it's not really tied to numbers either... no matter how many associates we have, our functions still need to be performed. in some ways, our jobs would be easier without unions, and their archaic rules.
Please spare me!
EWA's are spewing this false bravado saying they welcome a rif ! Nobody wants to go through that! This is the reason for the strike. The union want's job security protection and you would think at level 1 and 2 management would want as many union folk around as possible. Remember the number of management positions are tied directly to the number of union associates. So be careful of what you wish for, you just might get it! I see a lot of post's suggesting the union should accept no job security as the way of the world. Well, it may be but I rather to fight to keep what I have. Remember it's tough out here for everybody, highly skilled or not. Very few of us are just gonna slide into a better position than the ones we have now. If this were true we would already be gone. So spare me the "I welcome a rif crap!"
Since it is not Arbitration, it doesn't matter if the mediator is pro-union or not. "If the participants cannot come up with a solution that meets their needs, they cannot be forced to agree to anything. "
http://m.peoples-law.org/frequently-asked-questions-about-mediation
"It's mediation, not arbitration...even if the mediator is pro Union (doubtful), VZ will stick to their guns."
They'll have to back down on something - as will the union - in order to show bargaining in good faith and even more importantly, come up with a contract that will be ratified.
"It's all down to whether you folks want your jobs back or not, make wise choices."
Well, if I were to go back to the exact same job that I had over the past couple of years, under the same or presumably worse conditions, I'll just have to put my papers in. The company has managed to turn what was once a great job - a career, really - into one not worth having. Hopefully this state of affairs will change for the better, but I'm not holding my breath and am ready to move on.
@Edi - "http://www.goiam.org/index.php/imail/latest/13439-machinists-laud-allison-beck-as-white-house-choice-to-lead-fmcs"
Yeah that article sure sounds like Ms. BECK screwed over the "IAM", so much so they praise her and speak highly of her appointment by Obama to the "FMCS", why would they congratulate her if she screwed them over I wonder?
@ekm I think quf is repeating what they read in the World Socialist Web Site article (they should be classified as a hate group)... there is so much BS in there that you need hip waders.
http://www.goiam.org/index.php/imail/latest/13439-machinists-laud-allison-beck-as-white-house-choice-to-lead-fmcs
This mediator is totally pro-Union.
@cqy - instead of hurling feeble small minded insults, state your sources please, otherwise everything you just said is complete B.S.
@quf What bizarro universe do you live in? Allison f---ed over the IAM. You need wrap your mind around this intellectually before you open your mouth. These union guys are freight trains and don't have the finesse and guile to know when they are being f---ed.
It's mediation, not arbitration...even if the mediator is pro Union (doubtful), VZ will stick to their guns. It's all down to whether you folks want your jobs back or not, make wise choices.
Union leadership has some explaining to do to their members. The mediator brought in is from the Federal Mediation and Conciliation Service (FMCS) which is exactly what Verizon offered 5 weeks ago before the walkout. Will the union pay back all the lost wages to its members?
@mjw - wishful thinking on your part I'm sure, but I hardly doubt it. The union will be satisfied with the contract and then we get back to work. The mediator that they are using now is pro union. The company loses, again.
Verizon needs to save face. Cant you see that we arent f---ing around this time? Its a STRIKE you bozo....The company is greedy and they are paying for it. Once again, Labor steps up for the real people. CWA WILL PREVAIL
Union had to make a stand to get this far. Verizon would have had upper hand otherwise. It will be a fair contract now.
You might be riding it again soon and a bit longer this time
I have been riding the unpaid time off wave quite nicely, thank you. It has been a much needed break.