Thread regarding Wells Fargo & Co. layoffs

If they are accepting another job, how are they dipping on state and federal benefits? The responses here have been nothing but FUD.

1. WF is not going to check to see if you are working any where during your 60 day non-working period.
2. Your new employer is going to do a background check to see your employment history. Nothing wrong with that. They will see what your application shows - you are employed at WF.
3. This doesn't hurt anyone except the Karens that are jealous you are going to be able to benefit from the situation. The truth is, no one wants them and they know their only option is this sinking ship called WF. After that, it's back to McD's.

Go, enjoy the extra income and have a great life.

no need to call anyone names, people are not thick and understand the law. you might be thick if you don't understand that these questions are out there because penny pinchers are trying to figure out how far they can go to double dip (if not triple dip) on federal and state benefits in addition to WARN and severance pay.

yes - all these tools are out there to deal with dishonest people.

@1yln+18idrG2W and what's your point? That's at hire. For each time a background check is ran, there must be a signed authorization. WF does not have authorization to run a current background check unless you let them. Your potential new employer is only going to see that you currently work at WF, which is correct. I don't understand how you people are so thick. It's law. Read the FCRA.

having a signed authorization to verify employment history is a standard procedure (especially within the finance industry) to which a candidate will have to consent during the job application process.

To clarify - no one is denying that data collectors are out there. You are conflating public (gov't new hire databases) and private (worknumber). Try reaching out to work number and getting any information on an employee without employee authorization.

@1yqj+18idrG2W no one said it's not available. They said you are required to have a signed authorization from the target. Read the FCRA. You have a serious deficit in understanding availability does not equal accessibility. As an employer, you can put the information in the system, but the target authorization is required.

lol lying :)

https://theworknumber.com/ here is the proof that your employment and wages data is reported whether you like it or not.

In my state up to 50% wages can be garnished by creditors and this is a tool that allows that. so this isn't something like a tool for tracking d—beat parents. wake up people. you want to get caught lying to employers - do so. it only increases the chances of jobs given to people with integrity. I couldn't care less.

OP, have you heard about the law of attraction? By applying, you already decided the flow of events. THinking about something is like planning for an event. Now you could do it deliberately to create the kind of life you want. Congrats on your new job, hope you enjoy it!

If you people that are saying WF or any private company can run background checks without authorization work for WF, then that explains why WF is in trouble. You cannot violate law (FCRA) just because you feel like it. Not one of you have pointed out to any exception to the FCRA. One of you continues to make up bogus stories about the new hire databases. Court and law enforcement have access to them, not everyone, and definitely not non-government companies. Just because a database or collection of data exists does not mean just anyone can access it. It's completely understandable why WF is struggling right now, if you all are any indication of the level of workforce intelligence.

@ldb+18idrG2W do you know the difference between legal enforcement and private industry?

background check is one thing, payroll/wages and new hire reporting is another. many state and interstate agencies access to that data. how do you think wages are garnished for payment of judgements, child support etc? If there is valid reason to access this data, it can be accessed.

you all who are debating about legalities of background checks are kind of missing the point of the OP's dilemma.

The background check isn't what's going to create a problem for the OP if they try to "double dip"

It's whether he starts working for the future employer before the notice period is over.

Employers can and do find things out by the strangest routes, and you can have an offer revoked or even be fired after you start at a new firm. Not guaranteed, but not zero possibility - have seen both happen over the course of my career, at various companies. OP needs to decide if the risk is worth it.

Another legal perspective, via https://phillyconsumerlaw.com/fcra-background-checks/background-check-without-permission/

"It is important to for you to know that BEFORE employers obtain and use your background information, they must certify to Consumer Reporting Agencies that they did the following.

Advised you a report has been requested on you;
Obtained your written consent for the check (in a stand-alone document);
Provide a copy of the background report and a written summary of your rights under the FCRA at least five (5) days before making a decision whether to hire or fire you

By law employers must comply with FCRA requirements."

@ayv+18idrG2W, @wgv+18idrG2W won't have a real answer. S/he thinks it's totally legal to do an unauthorized background check (which violates the FCRA), but not providing the disclosure of what the information will be used for is the real crime.

@wgv I was curious so I looked up the case. It looks like First Advantage did not provide a separate disclosure to the background check recipient. If a person does not authorize a background check, why would they need the disclosure?

@wgv+18idrG2W read the FCRA. You cannot run a background check without authorization. That will lead to a lawsuit. If it's widespread, it could be a class action lawsuit.

If you read the link https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/hr-topics/talent-acquisition/pages/fcra-avoid-risky-background-checks.aspx, you can get the opinion of an actual labor lawyer. Stop gaslighting.

@iol+18idrG2W

My post was the first one on this thread and no I 'm not in HR, and i'm not one of the other posters. Just someone trying to help the OP think through their "if - then - else"

You 100% can run a background check without someone's prior authorization. There are multiple services that provide this, and it's composed of information that is in public records. It's a thriving industry in the world of online dating, and absolutely is used for business purposes without prior consent.

The lawsuit against wells fargo was because when using info for employment, the employer is required to provide a copy of the information to the applicant and the "how" it was used within a specified timeframe before they decline employment -that was the FCRA violation.

And I have personally known people who had their offers rescinded after everything was done/accepted when this kind of stuff came to light... the OP has to decide whether it's work the risk.

@ecf, I think you are lost. Sears layoff board is over here - https://www.thelayoff.com/sears-holdings

@ecf+18idrG2W you are full of sh1t. The database is one-way. The state can be sued.

I am the new hire database person and no I am not lying. Sears severance is transition pay and if you take another job Sears can cut off your pay and in some cases wants it back. This is what happened to a friend of mine and former Sears employee in California. Sears found out through the database that he had a new job, stopped his severance, and actually wanted some of it back. Normally the database is used to track unpaid child support, unpaid alimony, unpaid taxes etc. It is also shared by all 50 states. It can and does sometimes happen. Also the employer has to have permission to scan the database.

@vra if you work in HR, you should probably resign. You are going to have Wells Fargo involved in another lawsuit/scandal.

@vra+18idrG2W You obviously do not know the law. FCRA is not specific to credit, it covers all consumer information (criminal, credit, reference, etc.). I'm not sure why you are so invested in this. WF loses nothing. And really, do you think the new employer is going to go back to check what your last day is after they've hired you and you're doing a good job? This whole line of argument is delusional. For reference, read this: https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/hr-topics/talent-acquisition/pages/fcra-avoid-risky-background-checks.aspx
You're intentionally gaslighting. I was part of the lawsuit that won money from WF for impermissible use, so I know what I'm talking about.

It is permissible to obtain secondary employment, even as a FTE, as long as it doesn't conflict with your current work requirements. If you're in the 60 day period of non-working, then well you don't have any work conflicts. No problem.

OP - here are the facts:

• you should not even consider resigning until your offer is 100% solid... meaning you have it in writing, you have accepted it, and all terms/conditions have been satisfied. Read the fine print. That will include a background check.
• different employers have different levels of background checking. They don't actually need your approval to run a background check (anyone can run one on anyone for a fee, because the info in a background check is a matter of public record). They DO need your approval/authorization to run a credit check. Neither of these has anything to do with whether you are still employed at Wells Fargo.
• there is a separate service to verify employment. Not all companies do that, but if they do, it's the automated system that's been referred to below in this thread. In doing that, they're looking for whether you are lying on your resume. If you are still employed by wells fargo and your resume says you work for wells fargo there's no issue.
• while you are in your notice period (the 60 days) you are still an employee of the company. If you start working for another company, you have in effect resigned and since you are in the 60 day window, you forfeit severance (which does not apply until after the notice period/60 days). If you're wondering "how would WF find out" the answer is they might not... but what I would be worried about is your NEW company finding out, because they may consider that grounds for termination for several reasons I won't go into here. So then you'd be out of your new job and also potentially "fired" from WF in which case you would lose severance.
• once you are out of your notice period, the severance payments are not contingent on whether you are employed elsewhere or not.

Once the offer is 100% firm (first bullet), as others have suggested, you could ask for a start date after your last notice-period day. depending on how far out that is, your new employer may or may not be willing... And you shouldn't say "I want to get my severance payout" because that might make the new employer re-think whether you're the kind of employee they want... Just say you want to take a little time off between roles and recharge to enter the new company and job and dive in full force. If there's any difficulty with that at all, you really have to decided - do you want to be employed or do you want your severance payout and you feel confident that you'll find another job after you let the current offer go.

The new hire database person is intentionally spreading misinformation. As the other poster stated, the database is one-way, employer to database. Random people and employers cannot access the database. It is for law enforcement. Which raises the question - Why would you lie about this unless you work in HR?

@gad+18idrG2W why is it the 'right thing' to do? WF would pay out the 60 day non-work period and severance any way. You're a WF shill. WF has screwed employees and customers. Employees don't owe WF a d@mn thing if they are given notice, unless they are required to work the period.

@nrw+18idrG2W now you're just lying. The database is one-way. You have to report new hires. You don't have access to see where someone works. The database is for agencies to track down d—beat parents.

@nwa+18idrG2W That was my first post in this thread, so I’m not maneuvering again. The biggest point is that there’s a severance package out there if you’ve been laid off. It’ll kick in after. 60 days paid notice. During that 60 days, you’re still considered a WF employee even though you’re not working. Everyone is free to look for, and take, new positions. If you take a new position, the right thing to do would be to notify WF.

As others have said, though, if I were laid off and I got an offer from a new company, I’d have to evaluate the offer and start date against what’s left of my notice period and how big my severance is in order to decide. Ideally, I’d ask the new company to start right after notice period ends as a starting point.

In California all new hires are reported to Sacramento and any employer in the state can access the new hire data base for any reason. I know because I process new hires at work.

@sxw+18idrG2W you may want to look it up. Just because a SSN is collected, it does not give default permission to perform all levels of background checks. The FCRA requires that the target is notified. Check out WF's previous class action suit for details for 'impermissible use". Secondly, why would my new employer care if they run my background information through a data broker and it shows I'm employed at WF? That's what I said on my application. WF can still not run any type of background check without permission. You keep moving the goalposts.

@acd+18idrG2W, yes, but you are not getting two things: 1. A background check of your current employment requires that you give permission. This does nothing to help WF to determine if you are working at a new job. 2. If they are contacting an agency, then WF will not know about the potential new employer. Also, keep in mind that due to privacy requirements, if an employer uses a third party to perform background checks, it is a legal requirement that the target is notified and gives permission.

@gbv

Um, usually when you supply your SSN, you’re agreeing to a background check. Prior to needing it for payroll, this is the only permissible purpose for a prospective employer. Usually an offer of employment depends on a completed background check.

At that point, neither employer needs additional reason or permission, to access or provide information to a data broker.

Try reading instead of just flinging off the mark insults. And for the record, I haven’t taken any HR seminars.

@ftz

Big companies do not directly contact each other for employment information at all. The majority of companies use a service called the Work Number. If someone gives their SSN to a new employer, a great deal can be learned about that person through this service and LexusNexus. In fact, if this person took a job at a two branch credit union and their HR lady called WF, WF would tell them to call the Work Number.

My thoughts on both sides:

I, personally, wouldn’t risk it. I’m a bird-in-hand gal. But it might depend on the size of my severance package. If the new job was great, and my severance package was small? I might just take the new job and forgo my severance. That gives you the freedom to speak out against Wells Fargo, if you want, or sue them if you think you could have just cause. But if I were looking at a package of 12 months plus the 60 days? I would take the severance and ask the new employer if they can wait that 60 days. Maybe offer to come in for training during that time, so that you’re ready to go on your start date. (Someone else’s idea, here, which I thought was great.)

On the other hand, Wells Fargo can’t get anything right or do anything well. Sorry - but sadly it’s true, at least right now. You know that HR is completely buried. Tons of turnover and new people. Same deal with whoever they farm work out to. I think the chances of WFC catching anyone taking a job during the 60 day notices would be incredibly small.

Best of luck to everyone who has been laid off. These are just my opinions, right or wrong. But I would never criticize my fellow team mates who have been let go during such a rough time, since I am still employed and am not (yet) having to walk in your shoes. I sometimes have to be reminded to count my blessings, which are many, and to have empathy for those who have less. Sometimes it is all just luck of the draw.

@ahs+18idrG2W maneuvering again? If they call you back, you won't get the severance any way. You are a corporate shill polluting this board with intentionally wrong information.

The bottom line on the 60 days is that they are considering you an employee during those 60 days, but are paying you not to work. You still get regular pay and you still get benefits. This also means that they can reverse your layoff and pull you back in.

The reality is that 99.9% of the time, you get laid off and you wait out the working/non-working notice period and you separate. It is possible, however, that a new audit or regulatory initiative could force a business line to pull some people back in. If you’ve started a new position and get called back in, you have a choice to make, one of which will be to tell WF “no” and give up what’s left of your severance.

My recommendation, unless you have something currently near an offer phase, would be to take a breath and take a few days to regroup. Start doing some research and get some resumes out. Companies will be going quiet over the holidays, so focus on taking time with friends and family and getting yourself into a good position to hit the ground running in January. If you were laid off Friday, 60-day notice runs through 1/31. If you received only the minimum salary continuation (8 weeks), you’ll be paid through 3/28/21.

Oh the irony..... The constant complaints on WF’s ethics and work practices and now you want to know if you should do something unethical too. Hypocrite.....

Post ID: @bdh+18idrG2W Ok-sounds good to me. I’m obviously a babe in the woods.

@ynd+18idrG2W are you changing tact now? From "WF has XYZ company running unauthorized background checks and they will find out" to "Future employer will call WF". Have you filled out a job application this century? Every entry asks "Is this your current employer" and "May we contact". They ask for permission because there are serious legal ramifications.