Thread regarding AT&T layoffs

Don’t much matter cause theys gonna be fired soon. We’ll welcome y’all to the wire tech crew if’n you wash often and use sanitizer. No brown nosers.

@2vkv+14S5tKqn..This is correct in many organizations for sure. More tech savvy teams (Sales Technical Consulting, Network Technical Support, Engineering, etc.) operate a little differently in that the AM is normally not just a competent leader, but usually has a high degree of technical knowledge that can be equal to or greater than their direct reports or who at the very least has sound knowledge of what their direct reports functions are, usually because they performed in that role or a similar one at some point. 2 areas that need immediate improvement IMO are center support (ERC, GSA, ENOC, eCSPC, IOF, TPC, etc.) and field operations (AFO-Core (IEFS/TFS/Central Office), AFO-Business (DEG/Specials/ABFS). Some of the AM's within these organizations are extremely sharp individuals from a technology standpoint (as they should be since these are technical organizations), but a great majority of them lack even a fundamental understanding of what their L0 employees job functions encompass every day. How did we get to a point of hiring individuals in these technical organizations who don't possess or care about having a strong technical foundation??? Last I checked, Area Managers were at L2 out of 11 layers. Is it asking to much that they have "some" understanding of what functions they have oversight on?

The problem with most Area Managers ( and Directors for that matter ) is that they don't have a good grasp of what the folks below them even do.

They're making decisions about things where they have no clue about what it takes to get said thing done. The bad news is it only gets worse the higher up the chain you go.

It's like marketing vs engineering.

Marketing will promise a customer the impossible just to get the sale, while the engineers laugh at the demand to make it work within an unrealistic timeframe.

We don’t want to call our managers unless we have a question pertaining to the flavor of the day, we have done these jobs for decades. They insist we call or be disciplined for failure to follow.

Most are inexperienced or incompetent so, why do we have to call? Because of metrics, they have nothing to offer but harassment. Thanks boss, you just slowed me down another 10-15 minutes with nonsense.

Our first level managers are just paper pushers! All were gone for a week in training and guess what all the work got done very smoothly! Why would I ever call my manager for help he knows nothing about the job can’t do anything with my job & most time is not even in the office/gone home early!

Wow, 3 hrs. Our micromanager wants us to contact him in 2 hrs and wonder why it’s taking so long, even if it took nearly an hour just to arrive at the customers. I just now text, “bonded install, same thing different day”. Of course his reply is to contact him in 30-45 minutes for another update. You know HPC must be met for their bonuses, just constant harassment.

Only time is mentioned, nothing about roadblocks, customer code or satisfaction, feels like Groundhog Day over and over with constant berating.

@1pyt.....and when you circle around the block to beat the out the gate time you get dinged with a return visit....it's a lose-lose game....almost as dumb as the I've been on this job for 3 hours call.

Yes, the past was very different from today’s top down micromanaged style. The “dashboard” rules and green checks are the currency of the day. Customers are an afterthought and everything is skewed toward making metrics for bonuses. The days of being empowered and your managers letting you do your job unless there was a roadblock, are over. There are too many added task, meetings, etc.. that have been talked about ad nauseam. The individual contributors are threatened or disciplined constantly, even if they are trying to be Customer first. Despite all the rhetoric and propaganda about being a valued asset and customer rules, it’s out the window if you are missing any of their precious bonus metrics. Lower level managers are threatened constantly with their jobs to if they aren’t met.

For an example, techs may have a morning meeting, dispatch, write down information for first 2 dispatches, call the first 2 dispatches, need water, ice, remove trash or need to resupply in the A.M. but they have to get in their vehicles and drive around the block or down the road first then return. It’s to meet one of the dashboards green checks of being off the yard in .29 minutes. It’s totally unreasonable and more time is wasted for this metric. It’s .16 minutes in the P.M. which doesn’t really allow time to park, place cones or chocks, remove trash, do a dot check, check log book, put in time reports, place devices and capital tools in locked cabinet and wash up. This doesn’t include the extra time to sanitize vehicle due to COVID-19.

How many sales have AM's made this year?
How many repairs/installations have they done?
They are overpaid conduits relaying info to the real managers..the 1st lines.
They make few decisions, and are the most arrogant managers in the company short of the C suite.
And it shows here.
Keep posting dueces..you can fool your family, your friends and the newbies...the rest of know better.
And this is precisely why many of you are on the chopping block. How does if feel?

I was a PBX installer and a Central Office Tech for 33 of my 41 years and I didn’t really have nor need much management. It was my responsibility to stay under budget and make due dates and that’s what I did. Most of the time the managers I worked with stayed out of my way and let me get on with it. Maybe I was lucky but that was my experience.

All the added task, policies, new systems, continual updates, meetings, emails, town halls, videos, spreadsheets, red tape and micromanaging is due to a lot of non essential positions trying to justify their jobs. The L1’s and craft can’t focus on the customers or their job task due to all of this nonsense. The company is finally trying to reset back to a time of less management which will help reduce all the above which has no effect on bottom line or customer satisfaction. Last time I checked, the Customers pays the bills.

Sorry but tic tock, most of the nepotism and sycophants are running out of places to hide.

Despite all your nonsensical mudslinging the company needs to flatten redundant and non essential management levels. We have to get back to a more sustainable business model. Anyone with any common sense understands that 9-11 levels (depending on org) of management between L0 and CEO has to be changed in order to survive. There has become a great disconnect between the frontlines and C-suite as described in a Harvard review. They are too many filters (managers) both ways, down the line and vice versa thus the lack of trust and extreme micromanagement. The Company(‘s) was successful for years with empowering the employees and not all the red tape, policies and added levels of management.

To simplify, think of the old game where you have a circle or line of people and a sentence or story is whispered to the first person. They in turn whisper to the next and so on until the last person writes or says what they heard. Nearly 100% of the time the content, intent and context what was said at the beginning is totally changed. That’s why an outside consultant had to be engaged to make cuts because of the nepotism and sycophants won’t, they just keep moving the pieces around creating a lot of non essential positions.

One of the other posters already beat me to the punch:
“Dunno but if I didn't have a manager, would I really have to do any work? Would I just do whatever I wanted?“

This nails it pretty much. Union employees for the most part are entitled, grossly overpaid and completely narrow-minded. Most will take the path of least resistance every single time, no matter what. They will actually work themselves to death trying to get out of real work, only to complain on the backend about how hard they work. It’s mind-numbing. I was a Network Manager for 5 years over union techs across 2 organizations and I would not be overstating facts when I tell you that each and every one of my Direct reports outright lied, was not 100% truthful and/or tried to hide critical information at every interaction with me. Always making up BS excuses and telling half-truths and withholding information and they would do it with a straight face every time and then get upset with me when I questioned it. You don’t think Area Managers are necessary? You think managers should only be around to “help” you? Think again. You’re dreaming of a utopia where union employees (and L1 managers for that matter) are ALL highly skilled and have the utmost integrity which is utterly ridiculous.

: @nub+14S5tKqn...Your response is typical for an entitled union employee and I’ve heard it countless times. So, your main concern with your AM’s is that they weren’t your buddy and didn’t posses the exact same technical skills as you had as a “Technician”. And as a union tech who despised 9 of your 10 AM’s, you had such a close working relationship with them that you had absolute knowledge about what they did all day?? How?? Are we really supposed to believe that?? I guess on the flip side they should have had an attitude towards you for not knowing everything there is to know about management and leadership right??

: @nub+14S5tKqn...Your response is typical for an entitled union employee and I’ve heard it countless times. So, your main concern with your AM’s is that they weren’t your buddy and didn’t posses the exact same technical skills as you had as a “Technician”. And as a union tech who despised 9 of your 10 AM’s, you had such a close working relationship with them that you had absolute knowledge about what they did all day?? How?? Are we really supposed to believe that?? I guess on the flip side they should have had an attitude towards you for not knowing everything there is to know about management and leadership right??

Actually we do need area managers, just need to change what they do. A large group of managers need management and direct. But they don’t need to be driven into the ground with hyper competitive metrics. Area managers should be focused on managing their managers and not the people below the managers. 1st lines should be there to help, not hinder techs doing their job. Area managers should be there to help managers support their techs, not hinder them. You shouldn’t be running the the show but you are want makes the wheels go round.

Since I really don't know what they do, I guess we don't really need them.

Dunno but if I didn't have a manager, would I really have to do any work? Would I just do whatever I wanted?

The managers don’t do any work. Six managers send emails about completing a field repair because they have no technical skills. One craft employee is worth ten of them. Sorry if feelings were hurt.

Srea managers s— lots OF IT, LOL

Retail here.
My ARSM did make a difference. She started as a RSC, had been an ASM and RSM, so she knew the job of everyone in her chain. She helped us (the store managers) come up with ideas to sell more, and made sure all of us were involved to help our reps. She taught us how to hire well, how to hold our team accountable, and she held us accountable. We also had market contests etc.

She was moved into a job with the non-company stores, and our area manager isn’t the same. He isn’t bad, nice guy, but just doesn’t have the same impact.

So it’s not that area managers need to go, we just need good ones, that actually know the job, and want to help.

I don’t think DOSes do much of anything though. They could disappear and no one would even notice.

My AM works to balance the workload and handles escalation. Other than that, the team basically runs itself. I would not want to be the AM, they deal with all the BS, paperwork, and performance review which no one is happy with. Compiling power points and reports for the higher up is breathtakingly boring. Director and AVP have the same jobs, only the PowerPoints have better looking graphics and fonts and they are on conference calls all day. To sum up, a good portion of the tasks only adds to cost and little return on investment.

One application evangelist once said, hey, let’s get leadership to login to this awesome app to see dashboards with live data and eliminate all PPTs. Not going to happens in this bureaucracy, work is done on spreadsheets, reported on PPT, there is the required special handing and summarizing at each level of management. Live data is way too risky, you want every opportunity to word smith the message to cover your a–, yep, that is our operating culture. Remember the Covey’s speed to trust book was heavily promoted, ironic, there is no trust and definitely no speed.

I've had 10 AMs in 36 years. Not one...none...had any skills to do my technician job.
Many were too short to get a ladder off the truck, and all had soft hands from pushing paper all day.
What they do, is lean on the 1st lines to increase production.
Cut expenses.
Sit and watch GPS all day and TACR and try to get the folks who actually do the work on some step of discipline. Enjoy their office and tell usnot to idle our truck when it's -20 with a -50 wind chill.
9 were total jerks.
1 was not. In 1987.
They are not leaders, have zero tech advice to offer, and will not answer policy questions with any specificity.
Useless as teets on a snake.
But as you can see, they do think highly of themselves, and the company simply would not survive without them.
Big tough men with the ID on.
But would get an a– kicking it they talked like that off duty.
Ask yourself if you ever had any idea your deuce was on vacation.
That's how important they are.

esa+14S5tKq

ok so your first 4 AM examples deal mostly with craft titles. they cannot cut these AM's?

Well........The OP seems to have already made up his/her mind about what the position entails and it’s completely obvious that he/she is a L0 union employee or NMNU who probably doesn’t really have the faintest of ideas about what happens outside his/her very focused job function. Rather vague and silly question really as Area Manager’s in different disciplines and organizations and departments can have completely different job functions. A few examples below from the ATNO organization:

Area Manager Network Services - (AT&T Field Operations (AFO) IEFS/TFS-Core/TFS-Central Office)
Area Manager Construction & Engineering - (Outside Plant (OSP) Construction)
Area Manager OSP Planning & Engineering - (Outside Plant (OSP) Engineering)
Area Manager - Business Field Services (Digital Electronics Group (DEG) / Special Services (SSI&M) / Advanced Business Field Services (ABFS))
Area Manager - Network Ops Center (TRC (Technology Reliability Center) / Network Support / Transport Provisioning)
Area Manager - Advanced Technical Support (T3 Network Support)
Area Manager - Network Customer Service Center (Dispatch Optimization Center-DOC)
Area Manager - Network Process & Quality (Business Data Analysis, Program Management, Process Development & Control, Software/Automation Development & Support)

All of these Area Manager positions carries the same function of performing as Level-2 managers in a “Supervisory” role, but the skills and knowledge needed would vary greatly between them. An AM in Advanced Tech Support would need to have a very strong technical background (An engineering level of skill or manufacturer’s level of support knowledge) for whatever discipline they are in to lead/Guide large technical projects and work with external vendors and internal partners and be a able to supervise L1 and L2 technical support managers with varying levels of skill. Compare that with an AM in the Dispatch Center who most likely would not need much if any of a technical background, and who normally directly manages L1 Force Load Analysts or L1 Center Managers and L0 Union dispatchers and maintenance administrator indirectly for the purposes of load control. AM’s normally have 5-10 direct reports depending on organization.job function they are in.

As far as what an Area Manager does all day....I can only speak from personal experience in 2 of the above roles (AFO and Business Field Services):

1. You are on duty 24/7/365 unless you are on PTO (Paid Time Off) and even then you are not really “off duty”. Any critical problem or issue that is escalated and cannot be handled by your reliever comes to you for direction/resolution.
2. I had complete autonomy for hiring new employees (Once requisitions were approved of course) and for all levels of discipline, excluding termination, unless gross negligence was involved (An employee was arrested for being drunk on the job, an employee was caught stealing red handed, grossly inappropriate behavior, etc.).
3. I had overall control of a yearly expense budget that exceeded 7-figures (in Business Services).
4. I had overall supervision responsibilities for as many as 8 Level-1 Managers and as many as 120 Level-0 union employees at all times
5. I had to maintain a good rapport and open communications lines with peers and teams in multiple silos and organizations across the company as well as with organized labor leaders at the local level
6. I was 100% responsible for all EH&S policies being met and followed and assisted with all EH&S investigations within my coverage area for my team.
7. I was responsible for not just sustaining performance to standard threshold metrics, but also continuously enhancing performance through data analysis, coaching, removing roadblocks and igniting innovation among my entire team
8. I was 100% responsible for quality assurance for my entire team to include: managing quality to meet and exceed designated performance standards via re-work and fallout investigation and analysis and performing quality observations in the field on both technicians and managers to ensure quality M&P’s being followed properly.
9. I was also responsible for developing and leading presentations (both web-based and in person) related to performance, innovation, projects, safety, etc. with my direct reports and also with all levels of leadership up to VP level.
10. I had overall responsibility for career coaching, performance ratings and bonus dispersion as well as mid-year and EOY reviews for my direct reporting managers.
11. It goes without saying that I was on a lot of conference calls. Sometimes hosting or as a SME, but most of the time just participating. They could be calls with staff, leadership at all levels, project related, innovation related, technology related, process related, etc. I could have as little as 1 on the calendar for a day or the entire day from first am until sundown, back to back to back to back calls with very little break.

Watch YouTube and wait for others to work for their bonuses.

I am fortunate to have had a few good area managers. These are the ones that always found work for us to do.

Span of Control Guy: a repair or splicing manager can have 20 guys but some 3rd level cant take on 10 more am keyboard warriors?? haha oh ok

AMs are some of the most useless bunch. Overpaid do-nothing babysitters

It's all about span of control. There is a feeling that when the number of direct reports exceeds 10, another layer is needed. Or a group of individual contributors that are level 2 manager employees is managed by another level 2 Area manager. Groups of level 1 managers are managed by an Area Manager. 10 is the magic number.

most are just micromanagers with no clue .do away with them and have 1st levels report to directors. BOOM! streamline..then get rid of 4th level.BOOM ! enough with this archaic military style hierarchy .such a waste of time money etc.

I think area managers are more important than 4th lines.

Managers, IT, Billing, Field Techs, Mid level Executives, Supply Chain, Real Estate, Call Center,Gov. Affairs, Accounts Receivable, Fleet Operations,Risk Management, and the list goes on.