Thread regarding SAP layoffs

Exactly! The new CFO and CLO are only qualified for 2 reasons - white German male and experienced with layoffs/offshoring - in my opinion.

@r7 Maybe...but until now Software editors are investing in AI that generates "clean" code bug free.

The debugging process sometimes takes days for an expert because what customer sees as a bug, is sometimes a limitation in the product due to its architecture and the choices made initially.

The fix sometimes necessitates tweeking the product to do something it was not supposed to do before and the customer asking for it it too big to say no to.

Good luck training AI to do such things...Currently, tech companies don't want to deal with this kind of problems...

I think AI can help for new developments but maintenance and bug fixing...the ROI is just not worth it.

@gd Signavio is a toxic energy dump where a few people sitting on top are making all the decisions for themselves and protecting their near and dear ones. Just google Signavio and Bloomberg and you will find articles featuring habitual abusers, molestors, racist bigots who are been protected in the department and infact promoted to Director of design, Product design leads despite they facing tons of compliance complaints, open investigations and investigative reporting. They should have been fired the next day but their connections run deep in Signavio but let's see how far they can run before the sword of justice hits them hard.

@e9 ai will also do it

@ja General STRIKE!

@eb

Right on..... That's why he's known as the "Iceman" - he'll slice and dice everybody to salvage himself.

the legal team is never affected, can't their jobs be done by AI? chatgpt passed the bar exam.

@e9 which they may be, but i bet the productivity increase of the developers is significantly lower as that 30-50% is just what the autocomplete and boilerplate code generators used to do. So yes it may have increased productivity but probably by like 5%

Signavio hired People Leads, who were not technical managers, to oversee development teams. They were hired for their coaching abilities rather than their subject expertise in order to support overworked, stressed teams and lessen attrition. Around 90% of them have never worked for a cloud business, a SaaS firm, or any other technology-related industry. The action was contentious because many colleagues expressed worries that it was merely intended to boost the number of female managers, given that the previous diversity OKR about female managers (95% of these managers are women) and for their capacity to offer psychological support in the event of layoffs. Because wage increases and RSU allocations are also disproportionately concentrated to favor these non-technical manager roles, Signavio already has a record number of workers seeking employment, joining fellowships, or taking sabbaticals. However, it would be wrong to refer to them as DEI coaches. Their appointments are exclusively for the purpose of furthering Signavio's DEI ideals, and they just happen to have a coaching background. However, they do not coach their reports on DEI. Their responsibility is to implement what the management wants, such as forcing workers to provide inflated unfiltered ratings, limiting wage increases of developer roles, etc. They are ideal for implementing a 1–2% layoff policy and this is a direct result of this shift from conventional development manager positions. If other LOBs follow suit and we see more appointments for such managers to oversee routine layoffs, I wouldn't be shocked.

If they would sack based on merit, CK and DA would be the first to go.

All I can say is with a leader like Asam, if you are in any type of a Finance related role - you should be mighty concerned having a Board member with this outlook leading this Board area.

Zero appreciation for all the hard work.....

@dw When tech CEOs hear that SalesForce and Microsoft reached 30% of their code generated by AI and they are getting close to 50% ...it makes all competitors nervous and willing to put all their money and energy to reach the same goal without thinking about the conséquences...It feels like developers are now victims of witch hunting...they were stars just yesterday...

Who will maintain & enhance the millions of lines of code generated by AI ? Who will detect and fix it's hallucinations ?

@dn AI never works for code.

Vibe coding is a dead end. Any company betting their future on that dead horse is doomed.

@dc I might agree on Product Managers especially for products that moved to maintenance only which makes sens since no big new features will be added.

But Developers have always been protected and in every layoff the smallest number was the developers which also makes sens for a software editor.

The situation has changed with AI entering the game of code generation BUT the issue is AI only works for new code : it always failed where fixes had to be developed.

So if developers are in the list, it might be because they're in High cost centers and they were replaced by developers in Low cost centers.

@db This is bad news.

If a company lays off people at the heart of value creation (I would consider both developers and product managers such people), it usually means they are sounding the last hurrah.

Is SAP in such a bad shape?

Layoffs will not occur in a specific area. It will be in all areas except for a specific role. There is already talk about "too many product owners at SAP" following HPOM. I believe they will push for cuts in product management and have some colleagues take on their responsibilities under the guise of HPOM. Signavio recently promoted non-technical DEI coaches to development manager positions, and there are reports that 2% of developers and product managers will be let go in 2025.

@OP

You have to be really in considered to say this. Lay off is like brushing teeth. Like companies are the plaque and debris, but then again CK was neve a salesman or a great communicator.

Lay offs are the consequences of mismanagement, not planning correctly, purchasing companies for stock prices, over hiring. It has nothing to do with employee performance and engagement.

He says 1 to 2% layoff, who knows if it will be more.

Oh well.

AI start ups are going to get rich from IPO and employees will be left behind. Look at the purchase of Qualtrics. Someone made money and it was not the employees.

Yes we receive RSU, but guess what, All the major tech companies offer this.

You want to compete with the big leagues, then you offer what the big leagues offer. Be competitive.

Bad enough you have to do your job, now you have to navigate which department will be cut, that includes managers. So how do you navigate your career?

You take 100% responsibility for yourself in career progress.

Good Luck

@cy any ideas which product area already been identified as low growth? On premise for sure, but I don't think they have new hire there.

Bottom line is, SAP has adopted a forever layoffs strategy.
DA has given SAP the mouthwash to gargle and sp-t out undesirable colleagues at a rate of 1-2% every year.

@cv In my view the affected areas are only indirectly related to the laid-off people.

Especially in highly-regulated countries (DE and FR were mentioned here), they will go for the weak targets (people on probation…) in order to make the numbers and then re-distribute the people away from low-growth areas into high-growth areas.

This will cause some efforts, people will have to be retrained etc.

In less-regulated countries (US), they will skip the retraining and lay off directly in low-growth areas. More bucks saved for the shareholders, pushing the bonuses of the board.

@cr If you're looking for numbers on OnPrem, they responded to a question on the subject at the end of the meeting:

Down 13%...it seems that it was expected.

The Layoff will be in this area then ?

@cq Depends on your country.

In the US I would not worry, because your department has obviously growth potential, otherwise they could not have hired you. Layoffs will happen in other areas w/o growth.

In FR or DE, I would worry. It is much more difficult to lay off people there, and those in the probation period are much, much simpler to let go and hence an easy target.

I am new hire still in probation, should I worry about hire to fire?

@cj in FR we didn't receive anything yet...I'm not surprised because there's a legal process to follow..

@cj I can confirm that.

In another large region layoffs are already commencing.

And this will repeated year after year from now on.

Shame on CK and DA.

@ca unfortunately, somehow the results are looking pretty positive...even after the first round of layoffs and RTO announcements l thought the results were as bad as people on the field can expect. It's really disgusting and disappointing seeing this reckless agenda being implemented with no opposition whatsoever.

Date was mentioned in an employee call today. Sept-Oct. Start updating your cv. This is going to turn nasty again.

Isn‘t there an employee survey coming up in autumn?

I‘m really, really looking forward to an opportunity to express my current level of confidence in the board and the L1 level, my pride to work for SAP and my dedication to the company even if I would be offered an external position somewhere else… appropriately.

I wonder how they will explain the upcoming disaster in the ratings of the top management this time.

@c2 just a humble advice from an older colleague :
If you're young in dev, move to a team working on Joule this is where the money and opportunities are. The only pb is that it's either Walldorf or Bangalore.

If you're in other departments quickly learn BDC, Cloud, AI and you'll be fine.

Currently, SAP seems to be safer than other high tech companies but less opportunities for growth.

If you're able to take risks find a good startup: risky but if it works (get acquired) it's big win.

@by I've been at the company for less than 2 years, should be moving onto better external opportunities if this is the case. They were hoping to target older colleagues but they won't let go of their retirement severance.

@by since the previous layoff 2024 this is all we hear from mgt :

https://youtube.com/shorts/Y2r5qomZO9k?si=Z7gU_X4_mUhgDc3p

:-)

@bs They want to keep people permanently on the edge. Encourage them to leave by themselves w/o additional payments. Drive up fluctuation.

I cannot express in polite language how I feel about this.

DA should be ashamed. Luca would never have agreed to this.

It's horrible, now we know that there will be a Layoff but we don't know when ? how many ? where (locations) ? who will be impacted ?

I would've preferred the American way: a franc and clear information even if it's harsh but at least you know and you can start making decisions and moves...

I thought the board is the best.

I was wrong.

Deeply disappointed. I‘m really sorry.

For those of you listening to the Q2 2025 earnings call wondering where the info was sourced. CFO says that 1-2% layoff annual figure at around the 23 minute mark.

After Luka was dispatched, Hasso brought him in for a reason........guess what it was ?

....It's a totally different company than what it used to be...

I was touched when he said the layoffs traumatized him.

Thought I suspect his trauma was the $2bn VERP payout.

Shocking! We already knew that he is a complete tool! The CEO and CFO are just imitating what the the socially - awkward manboys at US - based tech companies do and say. At this time, it is a bunch of dweebs cosplaying as Jack Welch.
Give it a year and this pair of nefarious clowns will be wearing dresses and “Leaning in” when the Sheryl Sandberg style of “management” is back in vogue.

What exactly do you expect from an aerospace CFO? Leadership and creativity?