I've heard from managers who were interviewing candidates that they are immediately asking how quickly they can get a promotion... There are so many on my team who cause a stir or simply quit when they don't get their promised annual promotion. Some of these folks barely have the technical skills or soft skills for their role as it is... but desperately want to be manager... Not everyone is a leader... people just want to be manager so they can delegate. What is it like in your org? I am finding this is the common mentality on every team... if they dont get the promo they just turn to quiet quitting and put in 25% of the work.
11 replies (most recent on top)
What is with the promotion/ladder climbing culture?
healthy competition and always constructive.
So someone here equates "promotion" to being a manager? Uh, no.
Yep, this. Being a low level manager is not anything to brings about. you have little decision making and all of the accountability. Stop focusing on titles and worry about the number of 0's in your paystub. I actually once had a manager ask me what I wanted my title to be and what I wanted to do for work during an interview. my response? "You can call me Mary Queen of Scots for all I care, just put me anyplace you think I can do the most good and, just make sure the check doesn't bounce". After he stopped laughing he said "I think we need to hire you". And they did.
If they really value you, they will take care of you. If you are considered a light bulb (as one poster aptly stated) know for certain, they won't.
Oh and a FYI, Microsoft in the early 90's was the poster child for having light bulb employees. Sun Wasn't, DEC wasn't even IBM wasn't at that time. I happed to be checked into a hotel with a couple of Microsoft employees and at the bar they spilled the beans when we got to chatting and the booze got flowing.
The issue I have is that Oracle’s entire career track is open to interpretation/opinion. There are no literally metrics to which to hold management to…for example if I wanted to move to M4 one of the key components is “leadership”. Ok…so how do you measure that and remove the excuse factor that you aren’t leadership material.
In reality it’s a closed club for VP’s bu-t kissers. or one of their buddies from IBM. The system is rigged to keep performing ICs in their place - so ICs check out until that sweet redundancy check comes about to set you free
Most people would want to be promoted and advance their career . When they are not given what they are promised , It is natural that they feel dejected and look for other options to do so . What’s wrong with it ? I don’t see any reason they should not .
No raises planned for 2023/2024. Want to still fill out the surveys ?
Oracle's 'promotion/ladder climbing culture' is also a big problem at ICCs. High turnover because employees aren't getting moved up quick enough, whether they have the skills needed or not. It's about the title, not the work.
So someone here equates "promotion" to being a manager? Uh, no. A low level manager at Oracle is a punching bag that has no real say in anything. You might start to get RSUs when you join the management ranks, but you will always be at the lower rungs. Don't be a manager at Oracle. Its not worth it. Definitely not a "promotion".
I couldn't care less about promotions or titles, I just care about COMPENSATION. (I once actually earned more than my manager at one company) HOWEVER, if you make a promise to me and you don't follow through, no matter what it is, I'm out. Period, no discussion. Don't dangle a carrot in front of me and then yank it away at the last minute and expect me not to shut down and check out. I don't care if a manager made it in "good faith" and the upper level squashed it, the fact it I was made a promise and it did not get filled. Business is business, kids.
Nobody is entitled to a promotion but if it was promised to them then it’s hardly surprising that they‘re disappointed and might leave when they don’t get it. The thing is you’ve been very honest in your post about why people can’t be promoted or aren’t ready to be. In my experience managers at Oracle have not been that open about it. And HR will always find a reason to avoid promoting people so that doesn’t help either.
Managers need a reason to bring you into the club, demanding entitlements isn't one of them. You need to be able to help further some other agenda for them. The person who promotes you manager also need to believe you won't stab them in the back to further your rise.
Also, it's harder to recruit good ICs because there is more competition from other companies. There are fewer management positions so more potential candidates per vacancy,
Meanwhile people that know a lot and are capable of being managers stay put at the company because they realize management will never promote them