Someone posted about low salaries in support org . Lot of engineers are paid less than 85k . Lot of them have stayed here so long that their skills have become irrelevant for the market . No disrespect to these guys , but it’s a shame that these guys stick on to these jobs for so long with low salaries
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some folks i know in Support are getting raises + stock options .
Is "support" getting raises / bonuses / stock options? See Focal 2022.
Did our support friends treated better this year ? I hope this message board was helpful to relay the concerns.
“The true problem is you have actual dedicated, well-reviewed employees making less (some times far less) in inflation-adjusted dollars than when they started. The common retort is “why don’t they leave?” “
Essentially, you are responsible for your own career . If an employer doesn’t respect and reciprocate the loyalty you show them , you have to be smart enough to understand and move on .
$83k as IC3 in Colorado in AppsUL Support. One 5% raise up from $79k back in 2018. The raise at the time basically covered almost, but not quite all of what I'd lost due to inflation since starting in 2015. Inflation since 2018 has eroded quite a bit more purchasing power...I'd need to be making just shy of $99k now just to break even with what $83k would buy in 2018. I'm fine with no raises though as I'm sure Oracle hasn't increased what it's charging customers for support contracts in the last five years. Plus that a$$clown at the helm needs to be able to renovate his island and his new Florida bungalow.
This place $ucks a$$.
The true problem is you have actual dedicated, well-reviewed employees making less (some times far less) in inflation-adjusted dollars than when they started. The common retort is “why don’t they leave?” The answer is many, many have and more certainly still are leaving. Some aren’t exactly loyal but would stay simply for a 15-20% bump. It won’t happen by why not? Is Oracle really he-l bent on watching all their experience walk out the door and all their new people stay a year or two and learn and contribute nothing? The customer base and rhe continuity of dat support contracts are the results. You don’t think customers get frustrated when something that is solvable in a day or two turns into a month or never?
"The only people in support making 85 would have to be in the bay area. Anywhere else you’re talking far less...."
This is not true , All support centers , Utah , Orlando and Colorado pays 100 k + to IC4s
The only people in support making 85 would have to be in the bay area. Anywhere else you’re talking far less. 85 in a small/medium sized town is a very respectable income for one person.
The title only promotions are
a real kick in the backside. If that's what you got after working hard on nonsense like "automation" or KM "quality" or whatever new idea has been pooped out, shame on them. However, if after that you keep working hard on anything besides the real work of resolving customer issues (our actual job) then shame on you. You are a su---r letting yourself get taken. Why should anyone work hard for zero financial gain, title "engineering" has zero value. If you care about pointless badges or pats on the back you are truly pathetic.
If you do make less than 85k post your years of service and current salary. This seems ludicrous.
Post from TheLayoff.com
Absolutely they did. I'm an IC5. The title-bump. "We can't give you any additional money at this time." Again, they are absolute scoundrels. They did this to so, so, so many people. Yes, the smart ones left.
78k salary after 20 years. This is giving me nausea. It is a sign they donot need you here. Just curious if they changed your title without a pay raise to add insult to the injury.
Hey Congress was going to pass legislation to allow hiring unlimited H1bs at minimum pay rate of 150K. But existing employees who are US citizens can keep their 79K salary. I donot see why companies would object to this.
Post from TheLayoff.com
I make 39 an hour. No lie and been here over 20 years. Great reviews always but always “salary freeze” or “only certain % of team got raises”. 39 an hour is 78k per year and less (inflation adjusted than what I got to start). My other family members make more is how I survive and a few smart decisions outside of this shitbox of a company. It isn’t ideal and I wish I had left years ago and I’m actively looking.
It is shameful. I’d gladly talk to a reporter who wanted the inside scoop on Oracle Support. Customers deserve to know.
Seriously, looking at 37/41/50 per hour , that people are making, how are you folks making ends meet? Is this a post from 20 years back that this site is regurgitating ? Or are you folks joking, because if you guys made that much, you would have left the company long back.
Can someone earning 85K give me math tell me how they manage the home budget ? That pay will probably will just keep me alive so that I can report to work next day.
Are the customer's service contracts indexed with inflation rate ? Can that logic apply to fusion support employees salaries as well ?
Support is having anxiety about job security since there have been reports about several highly productive and valuable development engineers were laid off. No one is safe anymore.
This kind of pathetic pay reflects in the support the customers get from O. You get what you pay for.
wow this is an amazing thread. I think O might be thinking they should not have done the layoffs. As the employee revolt and lawsuits would be last thing they want and in addition to all the confusion this is causing with the customer base.
I know there were reporters on here before. Put your email in here and do a story solely on Oracle support and how they are running their business. Customers should learn. A lot of the experience Oracle chased out the door simply by not establishing any salary banding and adjusting. Support is worse but Support contracts stay the same. Everything you read here is true. 20+ year employees making 60-80k. Fu----g travesty and shameful for company to treat employees with such active disdain.
Post your email here. Many will respond to you. Write an article and expose these ba----ds.
There are many in support at Oracle who are earning less than $85k. Basically, the longer you have been with the company, the lower your pay is, and the more you are underpaid. I saw from another post that many people who joined 25+ years ago are getting screwed over in the $60k range. $60k in this market!!! How ridiculous! Employees from 15+ years are at around $100k, with some still in the $70k-$80k range. No raises since they joined the company. Longtime employees at Oracle are paid a maximum of $100k, and some make $140k by working a LOT of overtime. But overtime got cut in many divisions as well, so that was another "pay cut" if you could call it that. These employees also get no RSUs and bonuses, which is even more ridiculous. It is really sad since they should be paid $150k-200k+ with their years of experience. A person in support (and many other areas at Oracle) hired at $80k back in 2000 is still making $80k today in 2022! $80,000 in 2000 is roughly equivalent to $137,600 today, so there are getting a pay cut each year. With the rising costs of living, many are starting to struggle to make ends meet, especially in the Bay Area. They are starting to feel the limitations of their salary more than ever before. Some are even considered "low-income" in the Bay Area due to the low salary. In the Bay Area, an individual making $100k and a family of 4 making $150k are "low income." All it takes is moving to another company (like Workday and Salesforce) and their total compensation could double, triple, or even quadruple. Many severely underpaid people at Oracle were making $100k in total compensation (only base, no RSUs and bonus) and jumped to these competitor companies after 10-20+ years and their total compensation went to $300k+. The pay can easily be tripled by moving to another company. Many of these underpaid people in these roles are either going to retire soon or switch companies. Even though their skills might not be relevant, they can take these few months to get prepared and switch in early 2023 to another company. Oracle on a resume also does look great, so that's a bonus for those who are going to move. The one lesson is to never stay too long at any company, otherwise, you are going to be underpaid by a lot after a few years. Oracle is a job where you can come, develop your skills, get some experience, and move to another company with higher pay. Not a long-term job at all. In this market, you have to keep your skills current and move companies every few years to make sure your pay is relevant to your experience and skill level. You might be an excellent employee at Oracle, but your manager won't give you a raise. Better to leave. The employees who are sticking around all want to leave, because they all know how underpaid they are and know that by moving to other companies they can get the opportunity to actually advance in their careers.
IC3 @ $39 an hour. Been here too long, but not as long as almost everyone else in my group. Pretty sure the IC4s and IC5s in my group make similar or less than me, with maybe a few exceptions. So back-a$$wards. Mgmt is useless..."nothing we can do about it"....."the work is the reward itself"...."here's another 'opportunity' for you" (i.e. more work, same pay). Fugging clowns. I despise them all.
IC4 here @ $37 an hour, I have been there a long time.
I have seen the payslips with my own eyes, this was about 5 years ago and there were brand new IC3's making making $41+ an hour.
IC2 making about $30 an hour.
I have seen brand new IC4's on the technical teams making almost $45 to 50 an hour, these are typically ex admins and usually stressful teams though.
The longer you have been with the company the more you are getting screwed.
The bottomline is that loyalty and expertise are not valued at all.
Tenured people feel like sh-t about themselves because they know the college grad who knows 0 about Oracle (that they are training) makes more than them. This worker that makes more than you will be coming to you for help. You can see what a toxic environment this ends up creating.
Lastly your direct manager and their manager will say they completely powerless to do anything about it, they will not go to bat for you. They have 0 power anyways so they won't dare rock the boat usually. It's a fruitless effort anyways, they will let a rockstar leave and hire a noob who knows 0 for the same salary that the rockstar left for. How can you reason with that?
"85k? IC3 consulting team lead here and I make about 63k"
seriously ????
85k? IC3 consulting team lead here and I make about 63k
Post from TheLayoff.com
Yes everyone can always leave. But if the company is a good one there is rarely a reason. There are no victims here. Oracle is just a sh*toot company and reaped everything they sowed. The sad thing is they are desperately trying to play catch up while absolutely decimating their cash cows. Fu-ktards.
"Been here a loooong time and I know it is cliche that newer people in same role come in at higher salaries but it is true. I make significantly less than the 85K you posted. A lot of us do. "
I am sorry , but you only have yourself to blame here. If you are good enough to be employed by Oracle , there are competitors that would offer you as well . Not sure why would you not look for another job , when you know that it would pay you atleast 50 % increase in your salary .
If you are in Colorado and below the salary range you need to check this.
Colorado law requires covered employers to disclose the compensation range and benefits for positions when advertising or posting for applicants for those positions. A covered employer under the Colorado statute is any employer with at least one employee in Colorado. Covered employers must post the compensation range and a general description of all employment benefits in postings for a covered position.
"I believe H1b visas are helping to keep a lid on the salaries. Not sure if O also transfer folks from IDC to NA Mexico to keep a lid on things."
This is a wrong assumption . It is actually the other way around . When an H1b visa is approved , the salary paid to the employee goes through an audit process by Department of Labor to make sure he/she is atleast paid standard market rate in the city he is employed in .
This number is easily 100+ in any of the cities where O have support resources.
Also , O does not transfer anyone from IDC in Support Org
I believe H1b visas are helping to keep a lid on the salaries. Not sure if O also transfer folks from IDC to NA Mexico to keep a lid on things.
"The worst crime is against the customers. They are overcharged and while the experience walks out the door - or is pushed - they increasingly hire new hires or Mexican replacements that have zero skill. They also tell untrained analysts and to support things they have no knowledge of simply because all the knowledge is now gone. I’m mainly taking AppsUL but luckily there are third party support that pays better and actually has knowledge to solve the issue."
100% true and 100% agree. Another AppsUL support engineer here. Same story. Our support group has been diminished from about 35 heads four years ago to 7 heads today. A few more planning to leave soon. Only a couple of those that remain would I call "experts" at all. The strategy from our esteemed leadership is to simply have those of us that remain support everything. And when I say everything, I mean not just our related parts of our software (i.e. M&D modules of JDE software), and not just our software entirely (i.e. all of JDE), but rather everything in all of AppsUL (i.e. JDE, EBS, Peoplesoft, etc.). This is such an obviously flawed plan...we can't even keep up with what we currently support, let alone have any chance of success when forced to cover everything. More customers will get frustrated and leave, more employees will finally have enough and leave, and it will just cease to operate at some point...likely in the very near future. Pointing this out to leadership gets responses like "well either it's your cup of tea or it's not". What a bunch of fugging a$$clowns.
MS and MG, you both deserve to be shown the door, and to have every other possible door to any other opportunity in the world locked to prevent you from ruining anything else.
Customers - GTFO asap, you are paying for nothing of value.
Employees - You all know what's up already. We all need to GTFO or collectively demand some change.
The worst crime is against the customers. They are overcharged and while the experience walks out the door - or is pushed - they increasingly hire new hires or Mexican replacements that have zero skill. They also tell untrained analysts and to support things they have no knowledge of simply because all the knowledge is now gone. I’m mainly taking AppsUL but luckily there are third party support that pays better and actually has knowledge to solve the issue.
Been here a loooong time and I know it is cliche that newer people in same role come in at higher salaries but it is true. I make significantly less than the 85K you posted. A lot of us do. We are expected to help train the new hires. It is insane and it is a shame Oracle doesn’t do salary bands and pay experienced people a fair wage. In the end it is their karma. Mark Hurd probably enacted and SC and LE kept it going. Instead of inspiring their workforce they beat us down.