Thread regarding Cisco Systems Inc. layoffs

This perspective fundamentally misunderstands both the nature of innovation and the global economy.

The assumption that countries needing representation in diversity efforts are “behind” ignores the complex historical, political, and economic forces: often including colonialism and global inequities; that have shaped development outcomes, not individual talent.

Talent is not the issue, access and opportunity are.

In fact, many of the most successful innovations and global companies today rely on contributions from immigrants and diverse international teams.

The reason companies outsource isn't just cost; it’s also access to a broader pool of skilled professionals and around-the-clock development capabilities.

Dismissing global talent because it doesn't come from a familiar ZIP code is not only shortsighted; it’s economically self-defeating in a world where collaboration drives progress.

That is B$ (access to resources, opportunities)
Setting aside things were you need hardware, there is trillion of things that can be done in software. Linus did not need anything to write the kernel.
Have a look at this list https://www.google.com/search?q=most+important+personalities+in+the+software+developement and tell us how many people from these countries that jobs are outsourced to, you see there. Skip the business guys like Bill Gates. Guido or Linus did not need more than a computer. The parents of the OOP and C++ did not need hardware either

@vv+1k0ykt8r9

This perspective fundamentally misunderstands both the nature of innovation and the global economy.

The assumption that countries needing representation in diversity efforts are “behind” ignores the complex historical, political, and economic forces: often including colonialism and global inequities; that have shaped development outcomes, not individual talent.

Talent is not the issue, access and opportunity are.

In fact, many of the most successful innovations and global companies today rely on contributions from immigrants and diverse international teams.

The reason companies outsource isn't just cost; it’s also access to a broader pool of skilled professionals and around-the-clock development capabilities.

Dismissing global talent because it doesn't come from a familiar ZIP code is not only shortsighted; it’s economically self-defeating in a world where collaboration drives progress.

Diversity, when managed effectively, drives innovation, creativity, and adaptability. Numerous studies by McKinsey, Harvard, and Deloitte have shown that diverse teams outperform homogenous teams across industries. Economies and companies that embrace diverse talent pools tend to be more competitive, resilient, and better at solving complex problems. Countries that reject diversity often isolate themselves from talent, markets, and innovation.

You have to ask yourself over and over again ...why do these countries where we need the diversity to come from are so much behind. Why is their talent so much different than the local talent if they can't prosper by themselves.
The answer is simple, it is not the talent but the price. That that strategy led to what we see today, everything outsourced and the struggle to bring back industries that used to be very good here.
So no, innovation is not coming from there. Most of the RFCs and the technologies we work with today are invented in either EU or US/Canada. Give us a break

@ek Please go ask Boeing what happened there. Blaming Indian Pilots demonstrates what a low life you are. Wonder what happened to the Delta plane and recent american airlines planes guess you'd blame that too on the Indians.

"Diversity" as we knew of in the last 10 years did not include folks from India and China in High tech industries. They were majority. It has been for more than 20 years (maybe longer) that the Computer Science, Computer Engineering, and Electrical Engineering departments grads (especially in Graduate schools) in overwhelming majority of the main US colleges were majority of India and Chinese students. Those included American born citizens and foreign students.

CISCO has plenty of those foreign students (with H1B) worked in various groups - they were very talented and worked hard. Most important, they got paid at or over Market. Many of them were highly sought after. Why "other" American did not study those in higher %? I do not know,

The problem was those H1B abused outsourcing companies - CISCO paid them according to the law but they paid the workers with huge cut(some up to 50%). Trump should hammer down on those vendors like Infosys, Virpro, etc. They flocked the market and took legitimate jobs away from Americans. Huge number of India H1B workers worked in those vendors. That was the heart of the problem.

Numerous studies by McKinsey, Harvard, and Deloitte have shown that diverse teams outperform homogenous teams across industries

McKinsey’s “research” paper has been thoroughly debunked years ago. They made up some story about diversity leading to better business outcomes, and used it to sell services to improve diversity and culture. The left got hold of it and ran with it.
The rest is history

@OP it is past time to shut down the H1B scam. It is more than obvious for anyone with half a brain to see that this has been a con executed by Big Tech and their paid-off Congress critters to lower cost and in doing so decimate American workers.

Public companies with “number go up always” board mentalities hire g-nslinger CEOs to make the quarterly number; they will do anything (except invest and innovate) to make that so. Short term / value extraction is the MO. The easiest thing to do is slash the biggest number — $$ for labor.

H1B is a generational scam —- and it must be reversed.

@kw Well then time for Americans to take over and start doing the jobs that we have given to others. Thats the way and anyone saying anything else is smoking weed and high on that sh-t.

There’s enough diversity within US citizens. There are 2nd and 3rd generation of people of color in USA.

There is no need to hire international student just for diversity, there’s enough talent and diversity within local residents.

Many of the H1-Bs and international students are given special expedited interviews and fast processing. Local talent with better skills are ignored. This is bias and should stop.

Humans are biased. Very small percentage are unbiased.

Look at the IT department at Disney, Cisco, many UC system…. They got rid of US citizens and many other employees, and gave it to wipro or infosys or TCL. This is not fair and should not happen.

Look at HP, IBM, and many other big tech. They laid off thousands and hired employees in Asia …. All for low cost and profits. This is nothing but greed.

These Asian companies are opening local offices and taking over thousands of H1-B visas which are meant for US companies. They also abuse the system by applying multiple H1-Bs for single opening. Rules were finally changed this year, only one application per person.

Hire from other countries when there is shortage of talent in certain key areas. Just MS and no work experience will not qualify them for high skilled jobs.

There are not enough jobs for local talent. Canada cut down number of students entering by 40%. Even Ireland and Australia are cutting down number of immigrants entering. This is because of shortage of jobs, housing and greed by many universities.

There was real shortage in late 90s and early 2000s. After 2010s, 300K international students are entering USA. Sorry ! No jobs for everyone!!

When a system is abused by everyone, things will definitely change and new rules/laws will be passed. This is what going on in every country where immigrants are flooding in thousands.

@kr

The U.S. is a country of immigrants. Removing foreign workers would cripple industries like agriculture, healthcare, education, construction, and technology. It would cause massive labor shortages, inflation, and decline in GDP. The idea of pushing out all non-native workers isn’t just immoral, it’s financially illiterate and nationally self-sabotaging.

Wealth isn't built by protectionist fantasies; it’s created through productivity, trade, fiscal responsibility, and innovation. A modern economy can’t be fueled by slogan; it requires smart economic policy, responsible immigration reform, infrastructure investment, and a globally competitive mindset.

Diversity, when managed effectively, drives innovation, creativity, and adaptability. Numerous studies by McKinsey, Harvard, and Deloitte have shown that diverse teams outperform homogenous teams across industries. Economies and companies that embrace diverse talent pools tend to be more competitive, resilient, and better at solving complex problems. Countries that reject diversity often isolate themselves from talent, markets, and innovation.

Outsourcing when done ethically and with oversight is not a symptom of corruption but a strategic business practice used by companies worldwide to optimize operations, reduce costs, and ensure competitiveness. Indian outsourcing firms, like those from other nations, bring significant expertise, scalability, and value to U.S. firms. They often fill critical skill gaps, especially in fields where there is a domestic shortage, such as software development, cybersecurity, and data analytics.

The idea of shutting down all Indian outsourcing companies and banning international collaboration reflects a misunderstanding of both global economics and the strategic realities of the technology industry. While it is valid to advocate for American jobs and border security, it is equally important to address these concerns through informed, realistic, and globally responsible approaches not blanket isolationism.

Even within a "America First" framework, success depends on smart collaboration. Leaders like Elon Musk and others still rely on global partnerships to build successful, scalable, and innovative businesses. The reality is that the U.S. economy thrives not by retreating from the world, but by leading it through fair trade, innovation, and international cooperation.

America’s strength lies in its diversity and ability to attract global talent. Legal immigrants, including those on H-1B visas, contribute immensely to science, technology, and entrepreneurship. In fact, over half of America’s billion-dollar startups were founded by immigrants or their children. Blocking global talent hurts America’s ability to innovate and lead.

The assertion that other countries want America to fail is overly simplistic and divisive. The global economy is interdependent, and America’s growth depends on export markets, foreign investment, and international supply chains. Constructive engagement, not xenophobia, is the way to safeguard American prosperity.

It is breaking my heart to see so many talented US citizen out of work

Show me their linkedin or its not true.

Shutdown all the Indian outsourcing companies. They have got into every major company here with full of BS.

Tech CEOs are hand in hand with corrupt politicians all these years and taken advantage of outsourcing everything to Asia.

Even Elon Musk could not change Trump’s direction in America First agenda. Trump is focused on bringing jobs back to USA or reduce the debt. Atleast he is trying his best, not like other presidents.

There are many countries who want USA to fail but it won’t happen. Don’t let them into this country.

USA has enough talent, American citizens, coming out of colleges with good talent.

I don’t agree with all the policies of both the democratic and Republican Party. 60-70% of policies are identical.

No illegal immigration, close the border. No outsourcing and replacing jobs.

Farewell indian coworkers. May india prosper with your return.
American workers all the best.

"Many workers from abroad demonstrate a level of motivation and willingness to work longer hours for lower pay that is less commonly found in the current U.S. workforce."

+91 hands typed this message for sure.

Many workers from abroad demonstrate a level of motivation and willingness to work longer hours for lower pay that is less commonly found in the current U.S. workforce.

This is often due to the fact that many international employees have faced tougher challenges in pursuing education and career advancement.

In contrast, many new hires in the United States, particularly in their early 20s, often have not experienced comparable hardships and may exhibit lower drive or a preference for immediate comfort over sustained effort.

This generational and cultural difference contributes to a work environment where U.S. employees may be less inclined to handle demanding workloads or long hours consistently.

:-))
This is utter bs!
if the foreign workers are so driven to success why can't they make their own country a success? What drove Air India into the ground ?? Or their nuclear submarine to submerge with the hatch open :-)))
If I remember correctly there was another plane that run on code tested abroad (not saying were) and that cost many lives (somewhere in the middle east are)

The quickest way for American tech to fail.

@aa

You are so full of Sh-t.

@a9

Your path is to rise into management and technical leadership

I do not know which BU are in, but if you look around DIR/SrDIR, some managers and PEs are always occupied by L1 visa Indian people(its a portal to move Indians to USA). Your point might be true when viewed from 10000ft, but at Cisco its impossible to rise into management if you are not one of them.

@a9+1k0ykt8r9

Perhaps a good long look at one's own management ability within Cisco is in order, and if not reflective of continued growth; to then look elsewhere. The word is indeed changing. We all must adapt. Live work life like tomorrow is not guaranteed. One will be happier for it.

"If you are a U.S. worker, your path forward is not to compete head-to-head with lower-cost international labor on commodity tasks. Your path is to rise into management and technical leadership, where you can coordinate, guide, and own outcomes delivered by global teams."

I am a US citizen in leadership but even leadership jobs have moved and are moving to other countries. Cisco has so many incompetent managers in Canada and Europe while laying off managers in US.

No job must go to other countries if there is a qualified US citizen to do that job. Stop the Greed. MAGA

@a7+1k0ykt8r9

The era of high pay for low effort in the U.S. tech sector is over.

The global technology labor market has changed.

Even President Trump, while advocating “America First,” has acknowledged the undeniable value of international workers in technology to keep companies competitive. Companies that fail to leverage international talent will lose to those that do. This is not about opinions or fairness; it is about economic survival and operational efficiency.

If you are a U.S. worker, your path forward is not to compete head-to-head with lower-cost international labor on commodity tasks. Your path is to rise into management and technical leadership, where you can coordinate, guide, and own outcomes delivered by global teams.

By leading international teams, you will have your group’s work performed efficiently at less expense, while you drive value and results for your organization. This enhances your personal career security and aligns your contributions with the realities of the modern economy.

"Many workers from abroad demonstrate a level of motivation and willingness to work longer hours for lower pay that is less commonly found in the current U.S. workforce."

This is total BS. US citizens work hard and smart. Majority of workers from abroad pretend that they work hard but in reality they do not work smart. They are not efficient or productive. Hiring US citizens will save money for companies. MAGA

tech companies will find some way to weasel out of this sadly

Many workers from abroad demonstrate a level of motivation and willingness to work longer hours for lower pay that is less commonly found in the current U.S. workforce.

This is often due to the fact that many international employees have faced tougher challenges in pursuing education and career advancement.

In contrast, many new hires in the United States, particularly in their early 20s, often have not experienced comparable hardships and may exhibit lower drive or a preference for immediate comfort over sustained effort.

This generational and cultural difference contributes to a work environment where U.S. employees may be less inclined to handle demanding workloads or long hours consistently.

It is not just India. It is not just engineering. There are so many Cisco employees in Canada and Europe.

Companies must pay Tariff for any job, engineering or non-engineering they send to other companies.

This news is music to my ears. Next Trump should make the companies to pay heavy tariffs for jobs they sent to other countries.

It is breaking my heart to see so many talented US citizen out of work not being able to pay for their rent, kids, healthcare, etc. MAGA