Thread regarding Cisco Systems Inc. layoffs

good and on-rarget post @qk

Ageism is huge. I did 20 years at Cisco and left at 50.

Since it's been a while and no one has ever had an answer, let me ask the same question again: Cisco had a lot of 60 year old or older Engineer 4s, which was the equivalent of Senior Engineer at many companies, a title obtainable by aggressive young people in the first three years of their career. Is it ageism to trade out the 60 year old Engineer 4 for a 25 year old at half the price and in most cases a more modern skill set, or is it a wise business decision?

Paragraph about making the same mistakes for 20 years being equivalent to no experience reduced.

One could say we keep old people performing at the 3 year out of college mark at the associated pay rate, but over time they're still stuck with one way of doing things and aren't keeping up with what is being taught to even newer kids in school. At the same time even if everyone really busted and could perform at the absolute highest levels there just isn't the need for that many people at those levels which puts a further squeeze on older people. Compare Cisco to the largest tech giants with average tenures of 2-3 years and it's clear stagnation isn't a great business strategy.

I can relate to this. Be in no doubt that at 55 you will find it hard to match salary and find an employer. Ageism is huge. I did 20 years at Cisco and left at 50. For much the same reasons as you have put. Got tired of working hard being recognised by my team but not within the company. Decided to quit, spent 3 months with no work and then joined a small non-profit doing something to improve the world. They are enthused to have me, I love the people and culture and after a few years I'm not that far off what I was earning before.

You have to establish what is more valuable to you. Either the money or actually feeling like you are respected and still have loads to offer. If you leave it can be a tough road financially for a while but its way more rewarding and maybe you can find something you think is doing some good for the world instead of lining the pockets of rich people who dont give a stuff about you.

@hk - i just retired. it'll get better as you age. just make sure you save as much as you can and invest wisely.

this is a good thread, for a change...

not the most uplifting topic but still an important one...

I am wondering that those who are 55 plus, do you actually have money yo retire or just don’t want to retire yet. Curious as I am just 45, but hopping to get financially independent by the time I am 55. How much money is enough, what’s your 25x ?

You lost me at 55 yrs old

whats wrong with 55? one day you will reach there..

You lost me at 55 yrs old

I knew that going in. Had several older Cisco friends who guided me from the very beginning. They told me the following and I suggest EVERYONE at Cisco do the same unless they want to get sc--wed over royally:

1. Don't do squat
2. Act like you're the busiest person there
3. Decline meetings because you have "several urgent deadlines"
4. Say "YES" enthusiastically to anything they ask.
5. But don't actually do it.
6. Do not work nights or weekends.
7. Constantly hint at how hard up you are for money due to some sincere sounding issue, usually health related.
8. Miss as much work as you can due to health problems, helping family, regular medical appoints (have at least 2 of those a month).
9. If you see a project is starting to fail, start blaming it on someone senior. Everyone knows senior leadership are id--ts so they'll easily believe it and there is nothing they can do about it.
10. Three months before the regular quarterly layoffs, stop all work and go play golf, lounge by the pool are build a part time business. I did all three, easily.
11. Doing the above basically means you don't do any work at all the entire year. I did this for almost ten years!
12. When you are finally ready to leave, become very vocal about how stupid the leadership is. That will move you to the front of the layoff line.
13. Get laid off with very nice severance package.
14. Go enjoy life knowing you su-ked an evil company dry. You even su-ked more $$ out of them than all the senior leadership, on a percentage basis.

hi my friend, been at Cisco for 15 years and let go at 48, have to find a job, and hence got a semi government job with bonus and etc.. comparable to Cisco.. that was 8 years ago, and even that time is hard to find a job. once you get over the 45+ hill, it will be harder.. and you really have to tell them you know what you are talking about. and let them trust you. I suggest stay at Cisco and su-k every penny out of the company and yes, been miserable for sure for next several years, outside is not greener. however, focus on su-king $ out of them and make it fun to do so. Cisco market is not high outside, and reducing everyday, I have seen consulting job require you get on the plane every week to go somewhere, and do something new at some other company for sustaining their network, not fun job..

aka: there is no fun job.. fun is only lasting may be 2 months and then things settle again..

I think most benefit will be wait and get more $ and that is the real deal!

I have seen in my new company, we dont hire full time no more, we outsource our networking to some India company like HCL OR INFOSYS, unless you want to move to India.. we also get rid of networking architects, guess what, what is the use of them it the network has been set up already? we are not purchasing new routers, we outsource to AWS and cloud vendor ..

we dont need high paying Cisco architect at day 2. they do nothing I mean, AWS send their architects for free and our VP love them due to free design.

so , stay put and read paycheck every day.. and be happy!

On paper, it’s a great job—good salary, solid benefits.
...
I like my paycheck. I like my benefits.

This is the problem right here. In reality a good job is one where you get to use all your current skills and grow more, and statistically over the long term with judicious job jumps the money and benefits will be far better than anything you're going to get by staying 12-22 years at one company.

55 yo, 12 years @ Cisco...
...
my mgr has no real opinion about me...
...
...the idea of staying here for another 10 yrs just to retire at 65 feels soulcrushing.
...
I know I should probably just QuietQuit...

If you need to work ten more years as you imply putting yourself on the top of the next layoff list seems a bad strategy. Odds are you are going to be changing jobs whether it's by your choice or Cisco's, and justifying yourself in those next interviews with "the value I brought at my last job was quiet quitting because I just want the money and the benefits" will also be a bad strategy. Quiet quitting drains any drive you might have had and for many that doesn't come back quickly if ever.

You need to find a source of passion to build your energy even if it isn't at your job and figure out a way to build a sales pitch which blends your skills and that passion so you'll have the energy to push through a job jump and probationary period on your terms without all the additional drain on your energy from a layoff. My whole organization was let go during great times so most of us had new jobs before the day we had to hand in our laptops so we pocketed the severance. It was as ideal as a layoff could be and it was still very taxing. That won't be the case for the foreseeable future so it's best to metaphorically avoid a war on two fronts.

Welcome to any large company.

Don't leave Cisco unless you are ready to retire, because it is unlikely anyone else wants you at our age (I am also 55)

Just smile, enjoy life, phone-it-in at work and be happy you are not living some cursed life somewhere else.

Read some good books. Take up a hobby.

I'm right there with you friend, I am mid 50s and just over 20 years at Cisco in the sales organization. The last few years, the general work environment was growing more toxic monthly, then under Gary Steele it seemed to grow more toxic weekly (but that's another topic for another post and now he bailed anyway).

For my first 15 years at Cisco I never had to search for ways to enjoy my job, I loved the job and had a true energy and passion for it and enjoyed a successful career here.

These last 5 years began an increasingly difficult journey to continue to be happy and successful here. Over 20 years I was blessed with mostly good managers who had my back, so on many occasions my work and contributions were recognized, promotions and raises on occasion, generally all good.

However it's becoming too toxic to continue and I am looking around and networking, but taking my time and being thoughtful about it. No fast or easy decisions considering it's a full reboot starting over in another company, re-establishing oneself, etc. But every time there's some type of company meeting or all hands call, and the executive leaders drone on about the same tired talking points in their echo chamber of fake positivity, it's one step closer to the door for me.

The saving grace is that I have still found ways to enjoy what I am doing, it takes more work, but I feel like I can stick it out and stay here... but then I think, do I really want a good-enough job for 10 more years in an increasingly toxic culture? No. Not when I can go elsewhere and be in a great job for my final 10 years. While I have seen so many cases of life after Cisco, I have also seen many other people leave Cisco and then fight to come back. So that adds to the internal debate about where we are, where we want to be, our age (and age discrimination), experience, starting over versus changing teams internally, etc. Sometimes changing teams works out great for people, Cisco is a big place, and lateral movement can almost be like changing companies.

@ah+1jmwze5g1 has some good advice, but be careful when your old Cisco boss calls you saying Cisco is hiring after 1 year... they usually do not want to hire you they just want to know where you are after Cisco and send their people to retaliate on you if you are in better place.. Cisco has some sick DIR/Managers ... sadly... it happened to me..

The golden handcuffs are real.

There are always two sides to a coin, so there are always two ways to approach a problem. (1) Play the game and focus on the positives the job offers you (pay, benefits, etc.). Find & pursue outside interests or hobbies to distract your mind (and maybe bring you happiness) from the gloom-n-doom you're feeling. (2) Look & interview for other jobs that interest you while you're still employed. Yes, age discrimination is alive and well, especially in the tech industry, but it's not impossible to find work at 55. As stated here, there is life after Cisco. You have to ask yourself what you're willing to do or not do. Stay in your (miserable) comfort zone, or reach outside the box and see what else there is out there? Life's too short to have regrets.

I'm 64 and hoping to make it 5 more months. Because of all the money DODG has saved, they should be able to lower the medicare requirement to 60. If I had the energy left I would recommend it.

I was at Cisco for 19 years, let go at 55. I was a mess.

I hung on because I wanted the pay out. Yes, it was lucrative. I had saved a sh-t ton of money too because I knew they'd come for me eventually. All of it allowed me to take a year off. It saved my life.

When I left I was beyond burn out. I had no life. I didn't exercise or eat well. The only friends I had were at work. After I left, I was exhausted and slept for the first two months off of work coming down from the cortisol burn I had sustained for years. My health was a mess with high blood pressure that caused cardiovascular damage that will never repair itself. Yes, I did permanent damage to my body waiting for a pay out. Stupid.

Now I'm working doing my own consulting work. Get this. I went to lunch with my husband today. THAT NEVER happened working at Cisco. I was telling him how this current gig is amazingly low stress and the people I work with aren't toxic! I feel seen, my work is blowing them away and they love it! Oh, and I'm making 30% more than I was making at Cisco. (Listen to me, the longer you stay at Cisco your salary will fall below market value. Cisco doesn't give raises)

So why am I telling you this? There is life after Cisco. When I left Cisco without another job, did I feel like I was jumping off a cliff? Yes. Did I die? No. Am I better for it? Yes.

Here's what you do:

1. Make networking your full time job - OUTSIDE OF CISCO. Network with people who have been let go or left Cisco and have jobs at other companies. They are your connection to your next job.

2. When people leave or get let go from Cisco here on out, reach out to them. Help them. Remind them they will be greatly missed. Thank them for their contributions. They will never forget you and how you made them feel. They will be the first to help you when your time comes. Be the friend when they feel like they don't have any at Cisco anymore.

3. Take care of yourself now. Go to those Dr. appointments you've been putting off.

4. Skill the F' up. Get your certifications, grad school degrees, whatever you want, etc. Make Cisco pay for all of it.

Its really true what they say, the greatest things happen outside of your comfort zone. Take a chance on yourself. I promise you'll do better then you could have imagined.

Hey! Get out of my head

Its not like any of us are fooled what our jobs are , and yes is mostly kissing b utt and playing politics at every turn, if your manager doesnt like or think you are valuable then yes your time will be miserable and short, no matter how good you are at your actual job. This is the best gig for over 50 in the world, if you get hit, su-k it up and go work for the comp like rest of us did, its not great but adds to the pension fund, so be thankful and shut up.

You're not alone Stuck and Trapped. 55 years old here and stuck and trapped in a company that doesn't value people and don't value our clients either. I'm just here for the paycheck and looking elsewhere.

Before you make it seem like p-e drinking is negative, do keep in mind that you may be hurting people of some cultures which revere this practice. Just look up on Google about cow and camel pi-s drinking, one is associated with Arabia, while the other with people that have a sizable population at Cisco (India)

I was at Cisco for 20+ years, age 55+. LR in Feb '24 wiped out entire team including me, so take my strategy with grain of salt.

For 2-3 years prior to the team LR, I changed my perspective and found joy in growing the skills and successes of the younger members of the team (20s & 30s). I was always sharing my knowledge and ideas and allowing them to run with them, taking personal satisfaction when they were able to grow their careers and skills with seeds I had planted.

People from across the company would set up meetings with me to talk about my ideas, and I could tell when I was being milked for the next buzzword salad for them to use in their own circles - but with my perspective of giving back I was able to enjoy seeing things happen rather than get upset. It's all about perspective - if you can contribute in a different way to maintain employment and keep your sanity then do that. Agree that the 50+ job market is not appealing. And no real part time gigs available where you could share your knowledge and experience and grow others.

Be Happy! Why? Cause you're 55 and you have a stable job with healthcare (and perhaps no medical issues) and dental and vision insurance. You can pay your bills on time and not have to worry about how you will put food on the table for you and your family. You can afford to pay your bills on time and can afford to pay the mortgage to keep a roof over your families head. You have something so great that many other people may not, and that's called a "job". Sure, you are probably not happy with the job or the company or the project or management or colleagues, but that's just life. There aren't that many people who have been working for the same company after 10 years so excited about their jobs. Sure you want to work hard, learn, apply all your skills, and do the best work possible AND be APPRECIATED for it. But that perhaps won't or doesn't happen if at all or as often you would like it to. You are not the only person in this boat. I'm sure 90% of employees in this company or many other companies feel the same way. But there comes a point in your career where you realize that you are getting older, it will be difficult to find another job, and better to just stay quiet and keep slugging it day in and day out. Many of us feel the same way you do, but just keep smiling and keep going keeping our feelings to ourselves since we don't want to go through what the Federal workers are going through right now. So, Be Happy! Laugh, Smile, Dance, Eat, listen to music, and BE HAPPY!

OP "ABC" ? Ok, just try to to lay low.. You will be able to coast next 10 years, they will not touch you and keep you just for diversity sake...

You may consider leaving on your own terms. Plan it out. It will likely work out, it has for so many on this board.

• Consider a lateral move to another company. Smaller companies focus more on direct (and visible) contribution. You will likely be respected more.

• Consider Freelancing and/or consulting. You seem to have introspection, maturity and experience. I do not know much about you and your skills but if you have some tech or business skills and the level of introspection to put together this post, you can do this.

• Consider government or non-profit tech roles. It's not the best sector to enter right now but things will turn around. This kind of work tends to be rewarding. I'd be careful with government jobs as most are as bad as here but there are meaningful positions in Gov as well.

• Consider entrepreneurship. If you’ve ever wanted to launch something of your own now it'd be time to do it. You are running out of time and this is probably the last opportunity you'll have, once you hit 60 it may be too late. Pick something you like and push for it. Even a small side hustle could turn into something meaningful if you have grit and persistence (and I am just about to do this even though I am bit younger and with no kinds and some savings it's probably easer for me than for others).

Keep your head up and be proud of your work, something will work out...