I am seeing more PIPs for employees who have had exemplary prior performances. It’s a dirty management tactics that is totally unfair and unacceptable.
Amazon, Accenture and others are PIPing employees to save severances.
Does PIP separation allow un-employment benefits? What are the rules around At-cause, no-fault, or employers save that money too?? Any other state or federal help in USA?
PIP resume after earnings on Aug 13. Suspense is building up, keeping Sr Managers and Directors on edge for their own life. Major cut for middle management.
waiting to be pipped.
not going to happen when EVP->VP->SrDIR->DIR->SrMgr->Mgr are all from IIT and buddies and probably Indian high class vegans(like in DCBU), they just look after each other...
if Cisco wants to fix it, they need to LR/PIP the chain.
Management only thinks of getting maximum out of ICs, and use pressure, toxicity and PIP tactics to keep order and performance.
They totally forget this is not their role. They ignore or unable to achieve outcomes that are entrusted to them and become a leader. Only one percent of Cisco leadership does this or even thinks ahead, rest is garbage and a throw away thrash waiting to be pipped.
@dr the problem is genius, Cisco is either always in a constant hiring freeze, especially internally or there’s nowhere to really move. That’s exactly why you are seeing people stuck in roles much longer than usual and mailing it in which depending on your relationship with your management at the team either doesn’t matter, but you stagnate OR you get your name put on a list and if the upcoming severance isn’t going to be as sweet as it has been in the past dark times ahead.
How do directors and sr managers justify their higher pay grades and responsibilities? Not by writing key phrases and catchy slogans, or using AI to get few buzz lines.
They have targets and business outcomes, and financial goalposts. But none of this happens, or very minimal. Else Cisco wouldn’t be in this sh*those where businesses have to LR, but for the incompetent leaders who focus explicitly on driving outcomes from individual contributors and become dictators, not leaders!!!
Focus on self and on driving business goals and outcomes. Blame yourself and self-PIP and get off the boat. Such is the sad state of Cisco management. The whole layer has to go, like at Amazon, Microsoft and Intel.
Y'all have a childlike understanding of the world. The PIP itself isn't the problem.
Can PIPs be abused and misused? of course. And if your leader abuses/misuses, best time to find a new leader because one more leaders above yours had to approve the PIP, which means they are complicit in the abuse/misuse.
Have some people been PIPd and bounced back? of course.
If a PIP is ever a surprise, it means you and your leader haven't been communicating properly for, at least, the previous 6-12 months.
And sorry, but there's always a bottom performer in a top performing team. Can't escape it. If you can think of a better tool than the PIP, go build it and sell it back to Cisco.
Lastly, what you think is 'exemplary' isn't necessarily what leaders think is 'exemplary', and realize that Cisco and others operate in 6 months increments of performance. It's always "what have you done for me lately", and it gets harder to do that as your job grade increases. Again, if you have a better system, go build it. Or go convince Malcom Gladwell to write a book about it.
My unit beleague’d a PIP and fought back and fully discharged! You wanna swing above your weight on me you better know my unit will prime hard and force a ba ba bang!
Thank you bridge-it for this insight:
Looking forward to our upcoming discussions.
Not everyone is suited to senior leadership. Skilled engineers perform a critical, necessary function that keeps the company’s technical backbone strong. However, leadership requires an entirely different skill set: the ability to align teams with strategic objectives, manage conflict constructively, influence across the organization, and take accountability for decisions affecting the entire business, not just a technical subsystem.
If an engineer feels they could “do a better job” than current leadership, they should consider how to translate their skills into leadership action, such as:
Start leading projects and teams without being asked.
Learn to influence beyond their immediate technical scope.
Take ownership of business outcomes, not just technical correctness.
Develop communication skills to articulate vision and inspire others.
It is also important to reflect on career trajectory. If an engineer has not yet risen to a Director or higher-level leadership position, that itself is evidence that, to date, they are more aligned with the role of being led rather than leading at the organizational level.
Advancement into senior leadership does not happen by default; it requires demonstrating readiness, aligning with business priorities, and earning trust to lead people and outcomes.
Looking forward to our upcoming discussions.
Not everyone is suited to senior leadership. Skilled engineers perform a critical, necessary function that keeps the company’s technical backbone strong. However, leadership requires an entirely different skill set: the ability to align teams with strategic objectives, manage conflict constructively, influence across the organization, and take accountability for decisions affecting the entire business, not just a technical subsystem.
If an engineer feels they could “do a better job” than current leadership, they should consider how to translate their skills into leadership action, such as:
It is also important to reflect on career trajectory. If an engineer has not yet risen to a Director or higher-level leadership position, that itself is evidence that, to date, they are more aligned with the role of being led rather than leading at the organizational level.
Advancement into senior leadership does not happen by default; it requires demonstrating readiness, aligning with business priorities, and earning trust to lead people and outcomes.
Glad to see one or possibly couple underperforming directors here that know it all, and giving lessons to ICs on what it means to work, discipline and the ethics. Shame on you to talk like this to this elite group of very fine technical folks who work very hard to build this company and support families.
Many Directors are the biggest burden on this company. Wish it was that easy to get rid of these roaches, who are well connected and EXCEL in politics, NOT performance.
Cisco needs to toughen up, and get rid of these morally corrupt and insanely powerful but useless folks that do nothing productive whole day, don’t even show up on customer calls and take any business accountability. But talk about others these leeches are quick to point fingers. Time to PIP each one of these under performing leaders.
Coming LR would be a time of rude awakening for these MF leadership to get the F*ck out!
I have been where you are at, and since have left. Saying the following with respect.
This is what I have learned.
It is completely understandable to feel anger and resentment when treatment at work feels unfair, disrespectful, or exploitative. These feelings are real and valid, and it is natural to want to push back against a system that feels rigged or demeaning.
Remaining to malinger or lower output can feel like a form of resistance, giving a sense of control where you feel powerless.
The desire to punish Cisco can temporarily soothe feelings of betrayal.
But living in this mindset over time can trap you in chronic bitterness, reinforcing a cycle of stress, anger, and negativity. This will make one sick. It did me.
I went through a big cycle conditioning my mind to normalize underperformance and disengagement, eroding your self-respect and sense of competency. In the end it did not matter, I was shown the door.
Life is too short to remain in a state of low-level sabotage that, in the end, punishes you more than it punishes the company.
This much I have hopefully finally learned.
Total hilarity.
I treat this job the same way that senior leadership treats us. Which means they are fortunate that I don't take a dump on the floor.
The social contract around employment has been broken. And it wasn't broken by workers. If you are still upholding your end, you are nothing but a massive schmuck. And no one cares what a schmuck has to say.
Thanks for the insight but I'll pass.
Spite is a tremendous motivator and I'll be here until the bitter end, doing my part in lowering quality and quantity of work output, while also wasting company resources.
I really hope you can find a way to live with it because it ain't changing any time soon.
Sometimes, workers don't just meekly trundle out the door due to shoddy treatment. Sometimes, workers malinger or worse...
Understand that while PIP is officially a tool for performance correction, it is also a mechanism to identify, expose, and remove complacent and underperforming personnel.
Those who treat their position as an entitlement, or assume they can coast, will be outpaced, outperformed, and replaced.
Approach your role as you would a term of enlistment. There is a clear start and end date, with the expectation that you give maximum effort during your time of service. This mindset does not allow for entitlement, laziness, or the false security of “coasting.”
Do not wait for a PIP to become your wake-up call. Your ability to thrive here, and in life, depends on your willingness to toughen up and operate above standard, every single day.
It would be prudent to explore alternative job opportunities that may align better with your outlook and desired pace if you determine this environment is not a fit.
The technology industry requires adaptability, daily excellence, and mental toughness akin to a deployment mindset. If you cannot align with these expectations, you should consider whether your long-term career path should continue in this environment.
@a7...you are dead wrong. Companies, like Exxon have we-ponized the PIP as far back as 2019, by making the formal "improvement" process impossible to pass by using vague behavioral figures of merit. Additionally increasing the required percentage of employees from 3% to 8%. Ultimately this turns into a hidden layoff and hurts the employees further when trying to land the next job. Check other boards on this site.
A PIP is not designed to “get rid of people.”
It is a formal correction process
what freaking rock have you been hiding under
A PIP is not designed to “get rid of people.”
It is a formal correction process, not a personal attack. It’s just a job, and this is part of accountability in any disciplined organization. Use it as a chance to toughen up, align your actions to clear standards, and demonstrate you can meet expectations under pressure.
It is a documented performance improvement process that provides clear objectives, timelines, and measurable metrics to correct deficiencies. It demonstrates due process and gives the employee a fair, structured opportunity to meet expectations.
An LR is a separate business action unrelated to performance and tied to headcount or budget reductions. Using a PIP instead of an LR package for “getting rid of people” misuses the tool, exposes the company to legal risk, damages trust, and erodes accountability across leadership.
PIPs are for performance correction. LRs are for business needs.
They are not interchangeable.
PIP separations are categorized as involuntary, and the employee can file for unemployment.