Thread regarding Cisco Systems Inc. layoffs

I don't understand all the comments about d-mb people living in RTP or not being able to pay people enough to live in RTP.

Prestigious universities like Duke can't charge the outrageous tuition rates they charge w/o having highly educated professors and top-tier talent. UNC Chapel Hill is no slouch and neither is NC State. Frankly, NC State's technical programs are way better than the technical program my university had.

Duke Medical System is also a top-tier medical health care ranked in the top 10 nationally. Ain't no dummies there either.

Apple would not be building a new campus in RTP if there wasn't a large enough pool of highly talented workers in RTP. And Apple is one of the tech companies that is trying to keep workers in the office instead of remote or hybrid, although that may change.

The problem is, that due to the demand work tech workers here, the cost of housing has skyrocketed due to lack of construction and any construction is mostly connected townhomes & apartment complexes instead detached single family homes. Then COVID hit and the craze of paying $50K, $75K or even $100K over asking hit and drove prices even further out of proportion. I'm waiting and hoping for the housing price bubble to finally burst and bring back some sanity.

Personally, I'd take the job just so you can finish your PERM. Relocate and find a temp apartment to live in, but keep your radar up and keep looking for outside jobs. Startups are pretty risky right now (they are always risky, but more so now, with everyone laying off).

As an immigrant myself I would suggest focusing on getting your green card. If that means moving to RTP -which will be cheaper -, I would take it.

No visa holder should be allowed to stay in a USA based position when a citizen is laid off.

Most countries would never allow this.

@1kdd+1kJV220Q Of course it’s overpriced. You couldn’t pay smart people to live there. But it’s still incredibly cheap compared to nice places to live.

Are you guys smoking crack? RTP is not affordable anymore. Way overpriced for what it is.

I would ignore most of the comments about RTP being a bad place. I seriously doubt that they have done anything more than look it up on a map and viewed the area thru their stereotypic glasses which makes anywhere look like a dump.

I spent more than 20 years in the Raleigh/Durham area and it is a perfectly wonderful place to live. It offers a range of neighborhoods from (smaller) urban to rural. The people are wonderful, friendly and hospitable as long as folks don't talk down to them because they happen to live in the south.

Housing costs (rent or mortgage) is significantly lower than anywhere in the Bay area not to mention the taxes.

Thank you all for the inputs, I have seen people moved from SJC to RTP and many of them told RTP is a good place to stay with less cost of living when compared to SJC.

1. People who are saying RTP is not good or not worth to relocate, could you please list out the pros and cons based on your experience at two places.
2. Coming to the compensation, it's a drastic cut from my current pay, given no choice i have to go with it because of my PERM being processed and close to approval.
3. Anyone who's staying in RTP, could you please post what's a good/decent salary for someone with 6+ years of experience in Networking domain.

Please don't California my North Carolina.

Was a hiring manager at Cisco (left recently).

Your bargaining is hitting multiple policy challenges, that the only way around would be if you have a hiring manager, their skip level, and their ops director on board to fight.
The pay structure difference of a zone 1A geography to a B geography is significant. They aren’t going to bridge it, your best bet would be if you were to take the angle of this being a promotion in RTP. If it’s a lateral, you have very little to work with here. And they have made that clear. Often we are told we can’t hire above a certain level or placement in grade cause it breaks the budge modeling. This isn’t the hiring managers choice, it’s op’s and Hr.

The relocation funds come one of two ways, directly out of the new team’s operating funds (which is the same bucket as training, lab fees, certification tests) , these were drastically reduced during Covid. Or their was a limited fund with HR that it could hit, the probably is the one in Hr was reserved for high grade, high level ppl where the ops budget couldn’t absorb that type of cost. Generally it was a lump sum of $5000 or it was a percentage of your base, which typically hit in the $2-3000 range. It wasn’t both, and it was small.

Being this is a transfer hiring bonus or signs ins are against policy.

To me, it sounds like you are already at the cap of what they are able to give within their control. Could they possibly fight to get you something more? Yes, if they had the buy in off all those other people. The ops director managing the funds for entire ops, it’s hard to get them onboard in the first place and then HR has to sign off on why you’d be getting something not offered to others (which with the LR would most likely hit legal review)

All this to say; could you fight for more? Sure you can try. But the reality is that you are asking three different roles to fight “the system” at a time when they are fighting the system daily to keep things afloat. As a hiring manager, I would have told you, I’m sorry but I can’t meet your demands: take it or I have to move on.

Yes - RTP is a terrible place to live. You don't want to come here SMH...

i relocated from sjc to rtp years ago - it was worth it. weed is weaker, but otherwise i enjoy it here.

RTP is closing, don't go there, you will be LR'ed again.

That's nonsense. All jobs can be remote. This is a trick to lower your pay.

There’s a reason it’s so cheap in RTP. No one with more than a single brain cell wants to live there.

"Do you own a home in SJC? If so, selling it and buying in RTP, you'll end up having a lot more home for a lot less money."

The vast majority of Cisco salaries do not permit home ownership in the Bay Area. People waste their salary on rent and just try to survive in the Bay Area. Who can afford a 3 bedroom for $1.8 million in Santa Clara? Not a Grade 10 or 11

Just get a green card and you can easily move to another company

Since you're just changing roles, why would they give you a sign on bonus?

They should give you a relocation allowance, but it sounds like that's another casualty of the "good old days" where we had free drinks in the break rooms.

Do you own a home in SJC? If so, selling it and buying in RTP, you'll end up having a lot more home for a lot less money.

Based on your follow-up reply about being on a visa, I can see where you're stuck w/ Cisco. Can you afford to stay in SJC at RTP wages for the 4 months it takes Cisco to finish your PERM? Is that start-up interested in hiring you in 4-6 months after you complete your PERM instead of paying to sponsor you and re-start the process?

Having worked for a start-up, they don't always succeed and restarting the visa process with them could just put you back into this same situation.

I find it very telling that you've been LR'd in SJC and Cisco is saying it's not a "cost-cutting" LR, and that they want to re-allocate as many LR'd employees into new roles as they can, but they won't pay you SJC wages and let you work remote for the new role AND they won't pay a one-time relocation fee instead of the severance package they'll have to give you if you don't take the RTP role.

Most likely, the new RTP role won't last very long and you'll get axed in a year or two. But, in your shoes, with the visa situation, I'd try to point out that if you don't get the relocation assistance, you'll be forced to take the severance package and Cisco would come out ahead in helping you move. But that does mean you have to give up your choice of staying in SJC for a while.

I wouldn't want to be in your shoes.

Having to live in RTP as an H1b is even worse

Having to live in RTP is more painful than getting laid off!

I'm the author of post: I have an outside offer from a Start-Up in SJC itself, but I have my PERM in process with Cisco and would be done with I-140 in 3-4 months, if i go outside it needs to be started fresh and takes 1.5 to 2 years. Have 4 more years left on H-1B.

PS: People who understands the immigrant visa issues can assess my situation better.

No relocation package is the equivalent of not tipping a waiter. It's insulting and rude.

I was given the option to relocate a few years back because my SJC position was eliminated. After 2-years in RTP, that position was eliminated. I received an offer from another BU to relocate back to SJC. However, they refused to readjust my salary back to CA levels. Word of caution, once they adjust your salary, it might be permanent.

No one wants to live in RTP, even compared to SJC. So they should pay way more to make employees put up with living in such an awful place. That said, yeah just leave for another company so you don’t have to move to hillbilly land. Plus Cisco just laid you off - why do you still want to work for them? Eff em.

If you take it, please leave your voting habits in CA

SJC salary is in the highest pay zone for Cisco, so it makes sense that there would be a pay cut. SJC and RTP have different cost of living scales and different pay scales per grade.

I'd use the RTP job as a paycheck while applying to other jobs. The lack of money for relocation pretty much says that department has zero funding or growth.

Leave Cisco mess and go to another company and you will be happier and healthier

I would go for it. You'll love RTP. If you still need to get back to SJC, do it when the market turns back up.

If you want the job move. Cisco is cutting cost they won’t pay SJC salaries.