Thread regarding State Farm Insurance layoffs

@fyag the "just following orders" defense did not work at Nuremberg so people who jumped at the opportunity to ABC (anything but claims) don't get a pass either

Your logic makes no sense. How can you attempt to compare a nonsensical business decision against moral/ethical choices made in Nazi Germany?? I find it very sad that you found a way to liken the two.

Do you blame the CA&P helpdesk when they have to assist you on a program they didn’t write? Do you blame all Systems employees for bad programs they hate (but aren’t allowed to replace)?

It is still their job to support things they don’t agree with. It was no different for Process analysts to support some really really bad changes that were given by the dictators. As bad as those were, it still was nothing to be compared to the immoral genocide commited by the Nazi’s. Try to have some humanity before showing such ignorance.

@fyag——Sure. Questionable business choices clearly equate to state sponsored genocide.

@Yn12CWv-folq the "just following orders" defense did not work at Nuremberg so people who jumped at the opportunity to ABC (anything but claims) don't get a pass either.

EOM is also an idea sold to the company by outside consultants ( the same ones that brought you WFM and Metrics). None of those had anything to do with Process ideas or Six Sigma. The Process group were just the poor souls that were forced to support all that that ridiculousness. In fact, EOM was used in some of the early proof of concept ideas that took place long before Process was even created.

Careful not to place the blame too quickly on Process or Six Sigma, because doing so shows a certain level of ignorance. Many of the former Process members actually were former claim reps for years and understood perfectly what was needed. Unfortunately, the people with actual authority to approve ideas and initiatives are the very ones that refused to listen to proposals from those with real background and experience in the areas they serviced. Even the best ideas in the world were overlooked if you couldn’t specifically quantify the exact cost of the initiative and the exact return on investment.

Being that “service” is impossible to quantify without a worthy means to actually measure it, there was no way to get these great ideas approved. The same thing holds true for some great ideas that came through innovation central. If the decision-makers wont approve it, then it dies on the vine.

They ultimately reassigned and/or laid off most of the Process people with claims backgrounds. They didn’t want to hear the ideas they offered because they weren’t in line with the company direction that senior management wanted to take

Same holds true for Six Sigma. It’s simply a methodology to reduce waste from a process. It works best in manufacturing environments with highly standardized machinery and widgets produced.

As we all know, claims are not widgets...and humans are not machines. Every claim is different, regardless what the powers that be will tell you. Each claim takes a unique amount of time to handle properly (meaning thoroughly and in Remarkable ways to meet the customer’s expected level of claim service). The moment State Farm listened to outside consulting firms to refer to themselves as a “call center” was the day they made a major wrong turn. We now live with call center metrics and workforce management (for call centers). Neither of these have anything to do with Six Sigma. It’s quite the opposite, and they are competing priorities in the company. There are always compliance reasons that dictate much of the absurd processes that are put in place. Process could have a great idea, but they all have to be approved. By the time you get consulting services and other stakeholders to sign-off on a idea, they often add more and more steps to it for the approvals. Many times an idea is changed so much by stakeholders, that it looks nothing like it was intended when the idea first started. Would have been better not to change the old process if the new process is crazy after all the approvals. Nobody likes to change directions of admit to mistakes in this company. Too many egos, and cant have those mistakes showing on their metrics.

At the end of the day, the issues boil down to a company that wants to be the best...but refuses to even consider the obvious solutions. They blame cost as the reasoning, but have no reservation spending exponentially more to drive square pegs into the same round holes. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Terrific talent has been let go. They were replaced only based on geography (some claim it to be high salaries or old age, could be both). The reality is that new hires in the new location find out very quickly that the job and the environment are toxic at best. They leave before ever becoming proficient. They tell their friends and families about it. We spend more and more in recruiting, selecting, and training individuals that will never view this company as a viable career. As a result, they will never care about it enough to make it better.

Just walk away ... not worth your health, or integrity.

Makes me sad to read last posters comment. Especially if you have a SM doing all those id--tic side by side by sides and one on one on ones. Means they don’t have enough to do themselves. I had the pleasure (not) of working with one of our ex-consulting companies and unfortunately they drilled it into our heads that “numbers don’t lie”. Everyone at the top lives by this rule now, but fortunately we still have areas where the customer comes first. It’s a delicate balance with SLO, but we do what we have to do. Those kind of hours and working from home are crazy and you are going to k--l yourself. It is not worth it and I refuse to put that kind of time in as my family comes before before my job. They get 10 hour days from me and that is enough.

And TMs work 60 to 90 hours. Have too. Six Sigma is nuts. Weekly 1:1, side by sides, huddes, and walking around takes majority of your day. I love Watching the section manager watch the team manager watch the claim rep. Then there’s pulling data from multiple dasboards if available, and 2 phone systems. Maybe sell one of the planes and invest in s progressive phone sustem.

Majority of calls are misdirected, and professional employees are told their work schedule, time of their breaks... and if you don’t go it shows up Forcast and planning.

Then bring in time card readers, professionals clock in st arrival, clockot for their scheduled breaks and lunches.

They’ve dummied down the TM job..,and we complete templates. It’s ridilous to see a minor file reviewed by PD TM, BI TM,

Six Sigma was supposed to make us lean and consistent.....we have become inefficient, and and a sweat shop. It’s simply amazing watching claims people run to the elevators st end of shift.

And let’s not forget the process team when we started. Majority didn’t have claim experience and claims people were not to talk to them. Process would be excited about a workflow change, and we’d shake our head , as they always added additional steps.

It’s the claim rep. That should have been on the process team. They do the work and face to face with the customers

It depends who is the TM. If I got a recorded statement where someone says that the other vehicle came from nowhere, more than likely there is comp. neg. except in rear end accidents, usually.

The numbers I now play with weekly are at home. On my Quicken software. I have EVERYTHING on there, and am using planning tool to figure out exactly when I can give my retirement notice.

Nothing new. Just today’s version of it. Back in the late 80’s I worked auto claims in a city where they said our average claim inventory was 40per claim rep. I worked in the central service center of that city, and our inventories were over 400 apiece, with about 50/wk piling in. We were mandated to keep our “open” file inventory under 80 to make the numbers look right–so our Superintendant had the brilliant idea of coding the first draft in every file with a “1” to “close” the claim. I don’t remember all the codes, but we closed a lot of claims by ordering the police report with a $7 draft that closed the claim....then issued multiple “3” payments per file as we actually worked the claim.. We were still working 400 or more files, but they weren’t “open” on the books.

And we were dying. Salaried adjusters were working 6am to 10 pm. Estimators were hourly so they just got way behind unless overtime was approved, which it seldom was. But since we had a typical number of open claims, there was no need to hire anymore help.

@3fww—There were never 25,000 adjusters to begin with, so those numbers are greatly exaggerated. But there’s no question that digital photos, computerized estimatics, and electronic payments have eliminated a huge number of those jobs. But unfortunately, the Farm can no longer sell a policy with all those expenses to account for.

I heard that SF had a lay off of 25000 adjusters. So now if your getting your car fixed the body shop takes pictures & sends in the estimated cost. I do know that my insurance is just using used parts on cars now. Have a feeling the economy is going to tank within next couple years. Scary

This is a very accurate, and current, description of auto claims.

The rationale for working specific tasks within specific dates is tha All customers Receive great service. In other words, the solid, knowledgeable, typically tenured employees who are within SLOs, are then redirected to complete work of those weak employees of weak managers.

The most productive teams have to pick up slack that can’t or won’t do their jobs.

This "numbers game" has been going on for decades.

As mentioned from another thread from last year, some old school former claim reps can tell you some stories about games claim management has played throughout the years...some got caught and some got promoted. Games with sub recovery (depositing MPC reimb under 400); liability payments (waiting to issue 100 payments until 1st qtr or issuing them as dash 1 payments knowing there is a dash 3 coming).

So for now, just do what they say but cover your a$$ because if there are any audits, you're going to get caught in the net.

Unlike Brian Williams, I was there!

Agree with all, praying for a buy out and sooner the better I am so done with this company. I have been here 30 years and the last five years have been pure hell. Metrics has DESTROYED THIS Place.

It's been cheating in auto claims for 3 years now. And Team Managers know and encourage it! They know it is impossible to meet the matrix if you go by the rules and scp's. But it can blow up in your face , depends on who your manager is! You can give the poorest customer service but if your numbers look good, you are a superstar!

We’ve been saying it for years. IT’S ALL ABOUT THE NUMBERS, and it s---s.

A new claim review needs to take 15 minutes or less. Who cares if there are 4 cars and you actually need to call 4 drivers for their statements. You know very well that if you get even just one of the drivers on the phone, you’re probably f***ed and won’t meet the metric. If you speak to all 4 drivers and make a perfect liability decision, that really won’t matter because it took you more than 15 minutes to do all that.

Also let’s just make sure that 25% of all our liability determinations are comp neg, no matter what we are encountering or are exposed to while working claims in a given month. Claim handlers are putting comp neg on drivers for the dumbest of reasons, but I’m sure those making the stupid liability decisions were thinking they better do it because it sure beats being written up and fired instead.

It’s a metrics driven hell.