Thread regarding Sabre Holdings layoffs

Computer Science is not writing HTML, CSS, or JavaScript.

If that's what you want then you want a code monkey from ITT Tech or somewhere.

A Computer Science graduate will learn code monkey trade skills in their spare time but the purpose of their degree is to educate them in the theory of writing an HTML parser, of writing a database, of writing a TCP stack, writing a compiler... Most Computer Scientists end up settling for code monkey jobs just because it pays the bills but that's not the purpose of their education and many of them feel very frustrated by this.

Sabre has a few people who are decent Computer Scientists. Their skills and education is largely wasted on code monkey work so sometimes it's difficult to recognize them amongst the actual code monkeys. Look at the innovative products in Sabre. Look at teams making the impossible possible. Those teams have some good Computer Scientists.

A few years ago I remember someone demonstrated Chinese in green screen TPF entries and responses. It was impossible but they accomplished it somehow, no idea how because TPF is barely able to handle English even. But they did it. None of our competitors have Chinese in TPF but we do now. Not just Chinese either, they had all languages. That team needs some sort of reward. If they can accomplish that then who knows what other amazing impossible things they can do.

That's the value of Computer Scientists over code monkeys. They can invent something new which nobody knew was possible not just assemble standard components into standard products. They are what gives Sabre a competitive advantage. HTML code monkeys are a dime a dozen. Good Computer Scientists are rare gems.

The biggest problem I see with younger workers, is the giant boon in “computer science” degrees over the last decade from EVERYWHERE, and an astronomical number of kids going for them because they have no idea what they want to do but this path seems “sensible”, “easy”, and “secure”. However, not all schools are created equal. As a result of not really knowing what they want, a lot of these kids lack any of the passion required to excel in this field. They’re not curious, not easily excited, and have what seems almost to be a “refusal” to understand or figure anything out. The kids from these sh--ty schools that Sabre keeps hiring from and are only looking for ANY post school job, the very first people who will hire them, have embarrassingly incomplete educations and a total inability to pick themselves up to the appropriate level. Most of them for an intro into computer science learned how to use Java IDEs, and can’t code in a text editor or terminal to save their own lives. Sabre is also very in web technologies work, and I’ve seen kids hired to do that work that never even HEARD of CSS. How TF do you get a degree in computer science and not know what HTML, CSS, or JavaScript is? What school in their right mind offers 4 year CS programs that don’t include a SINGLE web application assignment!? Schools like UTD, that’s what. Then Sabre expects their minority employee base that actually has at least a decade of the appropriate expertise experience if not several, to teach these kids in 3 months or less what they spent years mastering (yet these kids aren’t interested, just want to know how to have their IDEs automate for them whatever product is asking for, or what code to copy and paste without understanding any of it), that these kids SHOULD have learned about in school but didn’t, should be responsible for teaching themselves if it’s something they actually care about (they don’t), and ultimately should have already known a good deal about before ever being hired.

So the huge boon in inadequate young workers may perhaps be a symptom of the changing times and how the next generation came up in this world, so different from many of the rest of us before them, yes. Their in professionalism, lack of experience, lack of interest, entitlement, and all that other negative crap though largely isn’t their fault so much as it is Sabre’s, for being lazy, and looking for cheap, convenient, and expendable labor. If Sabre invested more recruitment work in looking for young talent that have the education they need, understand what a job/career in computer science actually entails, and are excited/passionate about pursuing that work, then Sabre wouldn’t have these problems. One single CS hire from a good Ivey Leauge school like Stanford or Harvard, is worth 100 hires from UTD. There’s also plenty of standard universities out there like UTD (but that aren’t UTD) that even though they’re not Ivey League, are still known and renowned for their quality computer science programs. A graduate from a school like that would easily be worth 30 or 50 hires from UTD. Only thing is, these school’s aren’t local, their graduates don’t show up at our job fairs, and they need to be tracked down and sold to. This is work that Sabre is too lazy, or too stupid to see the value in, to carry out. Quality over quantity.

To make things worse, Sabre is stuck in the past, stubborn, and refuses to grow or scale with the times. Countless different large portions of the company are still struggling with how to adopt “agile”, while other parts still don’t have product managers, designers, developers, and qas all working on the same team, instead they continue to throw work over the wall from one “development cycle” type of worker to the next. They even have designers here in the U.S. who direct their development work to Bangalore, after which those devs tag in QAs in Krakow, only after they’ve “finished” development even though QAs had yet to be a part of the process. When passionate young new hires come in and try bring modern day practices and culture with them, they get shot down and have their hands tied. So when Sabre actually does manage to bring on a smart, qualified, and passionate candidate with the right education and passion for the job from a good school once in a blue moon, Sabre beats them down and s---s all that positive energy out of them that we could have, and should have, been able to lean on to help propel us forward.

So perhaps the original post here was directed at this influx of young kids from sh--ty school, but I didn’t get the feeling it was. In the event it’s not, don’t fool yourself into thinking that an entire generation has been spoiled, this is all as much Sabre’s fault as it is these kids. You don’t hire an ambulance chaser from a sh--ty a-- law school no one’s ever heard of to handle your will for you or represent you in a divorce, so why hire a bunch undereducated and impassionate graduates from sh--ty schools to do all the work for you that requires precise expertise and mastery in technologies they’ve never heard of, and to hope these “sheep” will be able to learn to solve enterprise sized problems when their only interest is being told EXACTLY which blocks of code to cut and paste so they can collect their paychecks and go home??

As a final quick note now that I’ve addressed Sabre is yet again the issue, and not this latest generation, the generations that the original poster tries to hold up to a “gold standard” aren’t perfect either. The baby boomers, even many gen-xers, contribute MASSIVE amounts of debt to this cultural deficit at Sabre that’s holding the entire company back. This generation likes to get “comfortable”, and is often resistant to change. You think you’ve “mastered” what it is to do “quality work”, that you’ve spent all these years refining your position in ability to “show up” and do a “good job” every day, that now at this point there’s no wiggle room for change. You take cultural change and new ways of working as “insults” against your finely pedicured routines. While you’d never admit that there likely isn’t ANYTHING new out there worth trying that would actually be an improvement, you’ve never successfully been pitched an idea you think is worth your time, that you wouldn’t be better off ignoring if the people around you would just let you.

So in summary, Sabre needs to quit hiring sh--ty, inexperienced, undereducated, and disposable labor in droves, and older employees with more tenure need to start being more flexible and receptive to what newer generations can bring to the table (when you’re able to recognize a diamond in the rough that is, when you’re sure your fresh young new hire isn’t just another number rolled off the line from UTD…)

You have to learn how to play the game. Don't put dates on your degrees, don't put any job down that was more than 15 years ago. Get some botox and fillers if you're female, even men can do botox; dress trendy not frumpy, study up on the urban dictionary and slang, take care of your body, a few extra pounds (30-40) are Ok, but don't be obese. Easy way to go from being " In your mid-late 40's" to being perceived as being in your mid 30's. You're Welcome.

Diveristy is not just the EEOC box check for race and gender. It also includes age and diversity of thought. The bias of olderer workers are slugs and yonger people are entitled is a bias that exists because it is not a part of the manager training and mandated by the executive team. Net: This toxic culture is an example of sh*t rolls down hill....from CEO down.

I am an older worker and a US citizen. I see plenty of hard working younger workers and plenty of fairly entitled feeling older workers. I don't think any generation has a huge tendency one way or the other. However, I see management that is so clueless about what their people do they really do feel most people (except their cohorts) are replaceable with another body--usually one that cost less. I do think there is extreme bias in some areas that HR should be addressing and hasn't touched. Let's face there is a bias among managers to hire people more like them than not and some groups have really amplified this. Perhaps HR has been told not to pursue, but it is really biting Sabre in lack of diversity, and unwillingness to hire the best candidates. Employees see these cliques forming and I think it gives rise to some of the bitterness we see on this board.

@Ti0P91r-vjh

This won’t make a difference for you. If you want to insult or teach your colleagues do it in the office. Say it to the face why hide here? This reminds me old yahoo board

There are plenty of stupid young people around. I doubt though they are getting wiser with age. The bottom line - once stupid always stupid. Arrogance is almost uncureable.

This crap again ? Jeez