What are the chances of surviving a pip here at Cisco?
21 replies (most recent on top)
I was put on one of these plans about 20 years ago - in hindsight they should have fired me while they had the chance. I got my head down and rode unashamedly on the back of others achievements to get where I am today - J Chambers
A PIP is just another way for a manager to put on the Lay Off list who he wants to let go. I have seen manager keeping people who do no work but are friend outside of work. Every manager at Cisco know a LR is always around the corner and this way they can keep who they like.
@OyR4SGt-1oxe said:
The new People Deal is a god send for HR when looking for a layoff - there's no documentation to counter their claims of poor performance - they can say whatever they like and the employee has no recourse
Exactly. That's why I said I thought it would be harder to do a PIP. Without documentation of goals, and whether or not you're meeting them, you can't be fired for not improving. Easier to LR you than to PIP you.
Given that Cisco is now having quarterly/annual LR's, why bother with the work of a PIP. In the time it takes to put someone one a PIP, then have a bunch of weekly 1-on-on's, then say you're not meeting your goals, and terminate you, it's just as quick to put you at the top of the next list.
Hi indeed hope Mr. JC might somehow be reading these threads.
Mr. JC, are you liking what all this has morphed into? What happened to frugality and "Cisco Family"...when everyone in the family is waiting to see if they will be the next one taken out back for a LR dirtnap?
@tit - Yes, almost every strategic initiative is a failure. PIPs are nature's way of making the ground-pounders pay the price for failing to make it work.
In other news, there's a story circulating in SJ that JC summoned CR and CD to a meeting without coffee & biscuits to explain just WTF they are doing with his legacy. CD thinks his authority is being undermined by CR and KK and is prepared to walk rather than let it continue. RT might have finished his collaboration journey and be moving on too.
GSX could be exciting. We live in interesting times.
Well said Confucius. You have a keen insight.
Imagine going back to your four-year college and starting over; except this time around not receiving a formal grade for each course completed for your whole attendance.
Every course you took, you simply moved on to the next course.
Along the way, the college would pick people out and withdraw them from attendance, with little notice and explanation.
What would be the value of your final diploma?
Would you think differently about the value of your education?
Would you just “get by” with your courses to “hope” to “graduate”, or would you put in every bit of energy and effort available to obtain the best grade.
Own your own future…or just continue driving in, having your smoothie at the cafe, and that you are maximizing your contribution, and that that contribution is being formally documented.
This is organizational behavior, candidly though some very smart people are thinking this brainwashing through. Do away with reviews for a good half-decade. Then everyone will have forgotten the past. Dumb down the work, focus on quantity of people versus quality.
This will ensure a good constant available quantity of souls to harvest, when necessary to raise the dividend, or cut cost.
Cisco: a once great company that has now mentally neutered itself into a cash cow. Sad.
A PIP should be a last resort. A half decent manager would only put you on a PIP if everything else has failed. I'm afraid you probably are doomed if you are on a PIP. Rightly or wrongly if you are on a PIP you are deemed to be an under performer. That said its not clear cut whether that means you are booted or LRd. If it looks like it might be too complicated to boot you out because of failing a PIP i.e. legal issues, impact on team etc. the manager might feel it prudent to LR you. Its easier and comes out of a central budget. Plus the person being LRd might feel they are being done a favour and therefore any handovers are easier. Of course that depends whether LRs are happening and they can somehow justify getting you on a list. If not, then you will be "managed out".
@OyR4SGt-1cck said
"I would have thought it was harder under the new people deal to put someone on a PIP because there is no more formal rating process, but what do I know. "
The new People Deal is a god send for HR when looking for a layoff - there's no documentation to counter their claims of poor performance - they can say whatever they like and the employee has no recourse
It's extremely rare to survive a PIP. If management at any level decides they want you gone, you get placed on a PIP and you are given goals to meet. Don't meet them and you're gone. Some times, if there's an LR coming up, it's easier on management to just put you on the short list rather than documenting goals, ensuring that you failed to meet them and documenting that failure, and then terminating you.
I would have thought it was harder under the new people deal to put someone on a PIP because there is no more formal rating process, but what do I know. I got nailed by a PIP/LR back in '11.
So you mean folks on PIP are LR'ed in upcoming cycle instead of being fired ?
Yep, I knew my manager wanted me out because I'd pointed out publicly that he was playing favorites with people who were working on failing projects while those on successful projects were getting shafted. Suddenly I'm on a PIP. I was going to ride it out to get the severance package all the while documenting every unreasonable assignment he gave me as an excuse for me to fail my PIP goals and then the workforce reduction was announced. Suddenly, the short deadlines for difficult tasks ended and things went pretty smoothly until I got that dreaded 1-on-1 invite for the first day of the announced notification period.
Now, they announce an LR, and tell the impacted employees the next day instead of announcing a reduction 30-60 days ahead of the employee notification. They've figured out that they get more work out of people during that 30-60 day period if they don't know it's coming. Unfortunately, history now says it's every year, so why go above & beyond in Aug on any task?
So you mean folks on PIP are LR'ed in upcoming cycle instead of being fired ?
You need to talk to HR that is designated to your BU. Once you have their number, you can ask what is the package for after PIP or not going through PIP. You can tell them your complains if you think it's unfair being on PIP. HR is there to protect the company not to be sued. However, once you talk to HR, this is only between you and HR, no manager involved. I was happy with the negotiated deal.
As a former manager at Cisco who's worked with HR on an underperforming employee, I can tell you that surviving a PIP is extremely rare. The record of your PIP is sent to your second-line manager and HR, putting you on the short list for the next LR.
If you're on a PIP, then they've failed to see any changes in your behavior despite the verbal and written warnings and your days are numbered. It is just Cisco's way of covering their *ss.
what are the options to negotiate an exit package while put on pip?
Show the middle finger and get out! It's not worth going down on your knees if put on a pip.
Pip goes the weasel!
Depends on who is driving the PIP. If your manager is looking for you to meet his expectations, then maybe. If coming from above, no chance.
Buy flowers for your mgr.
A PIP is a code word for legal coverage to lay you off or usher you out the door. It is not intended to be survivable. So dont waste your time trying...
Low. It happens but rarely.
How does a Cisco employee obtain a PIP? Almost every strategic initiative is failure.