Thread regarding ExxonMobil Corp. layoffs

This is a layoff forum not Retire in Five. Go ask your financial advisor and let us get back to our regularly programmed bi--hing.

Tangential question.

Thinking of leaving the pension lumpsum, by retiring at 55/15 with a future BCD at 59.5, to wait for interest rate declines.
After retiring, can I prepone the BCD if interest rates get lower

@9ndd+1sCWaUVy Knowing what the return on Common Assets was in 2023 does no one any good when investing for the future. Why can’t there be more transparency with this fund similar to investment opportunities outside of Voya. For example, if I buy T bills at 5.08% I know exactly what my return will be.

Follow up on Voya withdrawals for retirees:
I called Voya yesterday and there is a limit of 2 withdrawals per year, one for Roth and one for non-Roth. But beware that if you make any withdrawal, then you must exercise the NUA in the same calendar year, or you will wave that ability forever. So if you have stock that you would consider the benefits of NUA, keep the above in mind.

Voya is easy to contact (and understand) so you can call yourself.

FYI- Common assets accounts received 7% return in 2023.

The only advantage with Voya is low fees but my experience is that I can more than make up the managed fees I get charged through my current financial institution.

The problems I see with Voya are:
Poor financial advice or at least access to consistent advice
I don’t have any transparency for bond fund rates or even fixed income until it pays the
the quarterly payment
I have limited choice of funds. And with +$100-500k you can open up some
better investment options even within the same class of risk
You aren’t restricted on how many transactions you make per month and no delay

I still have my 401k with Voya and my lump sum outside but think of moving my Voya account soon. Bottom line is don’t let the fee structures determine your decision. Net return should be your focus.

Withdrawal of any amount is available in retirement.

Someone else may need to confirm but I don’t think you can make annual withdrawals from the Voya plan after you retire. It is my understanding that once you make a withdrawal (distribution) that triggers a clock where you will have to roll over the entire balance. The reason you can receive dividends without triggering an event is because Exxon does not consider the dividend an IRS distribution. I retired and 2019, so there could have been a rule change I’m not aware of.

I stayed at Voya when I retired in 2022.

Common assets earning 5+%

You can also withdraw as needed with no penalty anytime after age 55. See "IRS Rule of 55"

I do not know anything about NUA. Seems 1 smart sell would override this. Sell at $118, buy at $100. Repeat repeat repeat.

And these are the people who retire millionaires who come to this board for financial advice. Embarrassing.

Lot of long-winded self-advisors talking their moneys here.
Jibber-jabber for the most part.

The major issue I saw when I retired in the downturn in 2020 was that the vast majority of xom employees at that point in time were listening to Voya and conventional wisdom of 60/40 equity / bond fund allocations. This approach was a train wreck if you listened to Voya or non-savvy run of the mill financial advisors. Anyone with 3/4 of a brain at retirement in 2020 and 2021 did not put any kinda of money in bond funds or balanced funds as super high inflation writing was already on the wall with the trillions in government handouts being doled out. I retired at same time in 4q2020 with $2.4m lump sum and $2.5M in voya 401k and $1.2m in regular brokerage savings and non qualified accounts ; and got a financial advisory thru major brokerage Fidelity that deployed my money in suitable equitable and alternatives with zero bond fund allocation. Fast forward 3 yrs later, original portfolio of $$6.1m is now valued at $5.7M in Ira rollover and $1.6M for total $7.3m in portfolio. With higher interest rates now in play with bond funds and alternative high yield secured lending alternatives thru Fidelity platform; I have $4m allocated to ~6.5% yielding investments providing $260k annual income stream and then $3.3m allocated to equities. Once my wife retires from another Fortune 500 company her Ira will be worth about $2m in another year or few and we will reallocate the same way to provide ultimately $500k annual fixed income plus a ~5m in growth equity funds to leave legacy. Both spouse and I just maxed out 401s each year and lived frugally raising two nice kids with no college debt and no both kids college degrees and paying their own way. The fact I paid 1% annual rollover Ira balance (ie about 50k a year) to access higher yielding alternatives thru fidelity platform is well worth the fee. To each their own on how best to manage their money, but it was sad to see about 70% of my colleagues miss out huge in the last three years listening to conventional wisdom offered by voya or those whom recommended 60/40 or similar portfolios. Reading tea leaves was not so hard to predict super inflation and bond fund cratering in 2021-2023. Oh well Mathis simple, interest rates rise bond values implode.

Retired July 2021 and took a $1.2 mil. lump sum. I left my $2.3 mil 401 with Voya, I did not sell any Exxon stock and combined all the other investment options into the Balanced fund. I have 30% XOM and 70% Balanced fund currently worth $3.3 mil. I invested the $1.2 mil lump with a financial planner ( family friend) and am not happy with the results. I'm paying him 1% about $12k annually that account is paying me about $25k in dividends and is only worth $1.3 mil. I should have just rolled the lump into the 401 with Voya.

Roll that baby over yesterday 🫡

@dtd+1sCWaUVy, for the perspective. Can you share what was your year of service when you retired from XOM and your retirement pot balance were you able to build by the retirement?

Roll it over to an IRA, preferably with a good Certified Financial Planner to help out.

I retired a couple of years ago. Took everything out lump sum and NUAd a good chunk of XOM. Best decision I ever made. I’m making tons more money now through investing than I ever did for XOM. My single biggest expense in retirement is taxes. The only benefit of NUA is the low taxes it offers, up to 0% on the first 90k or so depending on your marital and financial status. Run the numbers yourself though, my experience is that the financial advisors really are plentiful and talk well but so did EM managers and we all know their true worth. For every dollar you earn in non-qualified investment income, or in earned income it negates a dollar from NUA sales (qualified income) from seeing first the 0% bracket, then the 15% bracket. And at that point it really doesn't matter anymore if you choose NUA or not. If you can’t effectively take advantage of NUA then you should have invested differently in the first place. It all depends on how much non qualified income you make. My strategy is minimize non-qualified, cap qualified to take advantage of low 0% and 15% rates. Donate enough and have deductions enough to offset most or all non-qualified income as it is hard to get rid of the non-qualified. I could cash out all most all of the NUA in one year at a 15% tax rate, that is what my financial advisor advises, because he is worried XOM could drop to nothing again for a long time. So I’m taking a long term risk from his perspective by holding the XOM NUA and maximizing the use of 0% tax rate as long as I can. The way I look at it is that doing it my way I get 15% more money in my pocket than the financial advisors way. To break even his way I would have to sell it and reinvest funds to earn 15% in one year, more if counting dividends offset. That’s possible, sure. But to my thinking that is more risky than my 0% tax and XOM value holding steady. Living off the NUA year to year now allows my IRA funds to grow at nice rates untouched. When I start touching the IRA’s that will get taxed as if it was earned income, so definitely not a good idea to touch them while using the 0% rate from NUA investments.. that is where the value of doing NUA is. If you can live off the little bit they let you have at 0% with some minor 15% top-off then its probably worth it to NUA. If you spend or have budgeted higher income needs for retirement then you will have difficulty getting the tax advantages of the NUA.

Roll it into IRA. WRT to “low fees” at Voya, you can actually get zero fee index funds; for example at Fidelity look at the index funds such as FNILX, FZROX, FZIPX, and FZILX which are similar to sp500, extended market, total market, and international market funds but there is no fee charged at all from fidelity - a true zero fee index funds. You anlso get access to a much broader universe of investment opportunities. Very much Agree with idea of ensuring portfolio mix a bit more balanced and with high yields offered in bonds and money markets you may wish to deploy some percentage to income producing assets. You did not mention approach on whether taking pension or lump sum. If you take pension and pension covers majority of living expenses then keeping heavier weight to equities may be appropriate but if you take lump sum and then roll into an IRA (keeping out of Voya) then also suggest a good CFP good help you with allocation of your portfolio designed for your risk tolerance balancing equity growth and income producing asset allocation. I was really never impressed with voya offerings or their customer service. Enjoy your retirement!

Why would you stay in Voya when you would have a million other options in an IRA account? Minimize risk, diversify, and stay safe

I agree with other reply. At your age & already in retirement, you should be in a minimal risk plan imo.

No idea if you should stay in Voya or not, but isn’t that mix a tad aggressive for actually being in retirement? Textbook advice would be that you should be much more weighted towards bonds at this point, but you’ve got the portfolio of a 24 year old with nothing to lose.